Drinks And Guest Chaos

SPEAKER_04 0:00

Hey Jesse. Hello. L and Lennon and Alex. Say hello, guests. Hey guys. Hey. Holy shit.

SPEAKER_05 0:14

A quadruple. Yeah. Is that right? Quadruple. I don't know if it's a word. Quadruple. Quad quad quadrupie. I don't know. I'm already drunk, dude. I'm hanging out. It works.

unknown 0:27

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 0:28

So I'm not going to ask you what you're drinking today because I know I made it. So I made this amazing drink with vodka, lime juice, freshly squeezed lime, lime soda water, and lime slush Alani. Sponsor me, Alani.

SPEAKER_05 0:44

Do not break the cipher on this one. Don't break the cycle.

SPEAKER_00 0:46

It's so good, isn't it? Oh, it's so crispy. So crisp. We're coming up on spring. Is it is it the 22nd yet? What is today? 21st.

SPEAKER_05 0:57

Whatever. We don't we don't do dates and times ever on here.

SPEAKER_00 1:00

We just tomorrow is spring, though. Tomorrow is. Last week.

SPEAKER_05 1:05

Or whatever.

SPEAKER_00 1:06

What the day this comes out the last week.

SPEAKER_05 1:08

I feel like we'll we will learn eventually just not even worry about time straight. No, not don't matter. It doesn't matter.

SPEAKER_00 1:13

But happy Friday, everybody.

SPEAKER_04 1:15

That's what counts, dude. That's what I'm talking about. Holy shit, we're gonna do this shit right now. Oh my goodness, Lindsay. Let's party.

SPEAKER_05 1:55

But I'm not ready because I heard that this is gonna be a wild adventure. So Lindsay, what do you have in store for us? I am not ready for this. And you know, I'm gonna put it on these other two guests over here, not on me. Yeah, they have to take it.

SPEAKER_00 2:13

Boys, it's gonna be uh a complicated one, a long one, and listeners, um, it is quite fantastic, though. Quite fantastic.

SPEAKER_05 2:24

Is it a fantasy of horrific?

SPEAKER_00 2:26

Uh it's okay. I I shouldn't say fantastic because there is some horrible stuff in here. I should not say fantastic. I'm sorry, I'm gonna reword that. It is it's just nuts. The whole thing is will blow your mind. And we've talked about this type of subject before, but this is a completely different case. This happened before the case that we've already talked about.

SPEAKER_05 2:49

This was yeah, so so you're talking about like overly cooked, unsalted nuts, like burnt nuts.

SPEAKER_00 2:55

Yeah, yeah. All right, so are you guys ready?

SPEAKER_02 3:00

Yeah, I think I'm ready. I'm ready as well.

The Campus Rapist Claim

SPEAKER_00 3:04

All right, in 1977, there were three women victims of kidnapping, robbery, and rape near the Ohio State University. One victim was able to identify the person who would be called the campus rapist. And this man's name was Billy Milligan.

SPEAKER_05 3:25

So many people fucking around in fucking campuses, man.

SPEAKER_00 3:29

And that's who we're drinking about today is Billy Milligan.

SPEAKER_05 3:33

Billy Milligan.

SPEAKER_00 3:35

But Billy, he said it wasn't him. It was about four of his 24 alternate personalities.

SPEAKER_05 3:45

No, Lindsay. No, Lindsay, it wasn't me.

SPEAKER_00 3:49

And the robber was Reagan, I'm gonna struggle with this, Reagan Vada Vodaskovich, who was a Yugoslav communist, he would commit robbery in what is described as a Robin Hood method.

SPEAKER_01 4:05

You nailed it, Lindsay. Did I? Holy shit. So the same person, but another person.

SPEAKER_00 4:10

Don't laugh because this is real. But it's there's okay, so like I said, you're gonna have to pay attention.

SPEAKER_05 4:17

It's what? I fully grasp all this. I mean, we've been through this, and I've got to be a little bit more. We have covered, I nailed it.

SPEAKER_00 4:22

Y'all weren't here for this, but we have covered another young lady who also, well, she's she's not young, but it happened to her as a at a young age, and she had 2,500 personalities. Yes.

SPEAKER_01 4:36

Uh well, I just don't feel like it's uh personality. I feel like it's your emotions.

SPEAKER_05 4:42

Well, Landon, let's uh let's get through the case and then I want to I want to give you guys just a little bit of platform right now. Stand up on your soapbox and talk now, and then we'll talk at the end of this and let's see where your mind's at. Because the understanding when I went through Jenny Haynes is uh 2,500 and and and more. And she she has a documentary out and she supports us. It's it's our actually biggest podcast.

SPEAKER_00 5:05

She's from Australia.

SPEAKER_05 5:06

Yeah, in Australia. That's our biggest podcast following right now. So I want you guys to go ahead and speak right now. What what are you thinking right now before I dive in? And we just got our toe in the water. Tell us what you're thinking right now. I want to know. That way we can find out later on uh what you come up with in your mind.

SPEAKER_01 5:26

I don't know, but I know I'm ADHD and I know I have a lot of like disabilities and stuff that aren't really big of a deal, but it's like in your mind disabilities. And I just feel like the person I am now, I I know I have control of my body, and I'm not gonna put another personality taking control of something like you have control of your body, you know what you're doing, no matter what.

SPEAKER_00 5:55

But where my argument lies with this, this particular so this is called uh dissociative identity disorder, and these people do not have control over the other identities, so there's a difference. But we're gonna go we're gonna go through.

SPEAKER_02 6:09

And as far as Alex, Alex, what do you think about it? I mean, it's crazy that someone can just be a hundred different people. Yes, or more, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 6:18

And he so Billy has 24. So the personalities involved in these crimes that Billy is now being charged with, like I said, was Reagan. He is a Yugoslav communist Robin Hood type robber. Now the rapes were committed by Adelena, which is a feminine personality that he has, and she is described as a 19-year-old lesbian. Now, Billy himself would have no recollections like Billy. So Billy is the core. Billy is the the he has no recollection of these crimes. But how do you how does he remember this stuff? Okay, so we're gonna get through. We're gonna go there. It's all it's gonna be a long way, but we're gonna get through. Well, he doesn't, he doesn't. That's what I'm saying. He does not remember them. The core personality does not. Yeah, the personality is the stories now. Let me get there. Yeah, then we're and I'm gonna explain it to you.

Family History And Early Alters

SPEAKER_05 7:18

Like, okay, to to break it down, and I'm I'm not trying to like to force any of these ideologies on emotions and people disassociating their self-being. Um, they're going through something traumatic to uh the emotional effect of them acting out on horrific things, or horrific things happening to them and they disassociate also. So you have to put that into mind perspective of something traumatic to the point of doing the most explicit things you could ever imagine, and then actually putting yourself aside and then creating somebody else that takes on that um that personality.

SPEAKER_00 7:57

So Billy was born William Stanley Morrison on February 14th, Valentine's baby, in 1955, in the Miami area, to Dorothy Sands and Johnny Morrison. Dorothy was from Lancaster, Ohio, and had been previously married. And when she divorced, she moved to Miami and worked as a lounge singer and met Johnny, who was a Jewish comedian.

SPEAKER_05 8:23

So they're musician. A lot of entertainment. Entertainment. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 8:27

Not unusual to be loved by anyone. Now they also had Jim. They had Jim Morrison. Not not the not the Jim Morrison, but they had a Jim Morrison.

SPEAKER_04 8:39

You see me lying up right there.

SPEAKER_00 8:41

I was like, I deep dove a little bit to make sure. I was like, wait a minute. Wait a minute. So they had Jim, who was born before Billy, and then Kathy Joe, who came after.

SPEAKER_04 8:51

Love me two times, babe.

SPEAKER_00 8:54

Now, Johnny, he wasn't really good at fatherhood. He struggled with depression, alcoholism, and had a gambling problem. Now, his gambling problem was like dangerous. Like he was involved with lone sharks and things like that. And I'm gonna talk about it just a little bit more. But first, he attempted suicide by overdosing on sleeping pills and chasing them down with a bottle of scotch.

SPEAKER_05 9:20

Fuck, this is a deep salad.

SPEAKER_00 9:22

And later on, or just a few months later, uh, on January 17th, 1959. So little Billy would have been about four, um, he completed suicide by carbon monoxide poisoning.

SPEAKER_05 9:38

In his car. Oh, the hose. Damn, dude. I want to go out like that. Nobody wants to go out like that. Oh my God.

SPEAKER_00 9:46

And we've seen so many like that in movies throughout our lifetime, especially as millennials.

SPEAKER_05 9:52

Even the bad Santa where he's all like, leave me alone, I'm okay. Fucking midsummer.

SPEAKER_00 9:57

God damn, midsummer.

SPEAKER_05 9:58

Yeah, midsummer. Midsummer. Check that out. Midsummer.

SPEAKER_00 10:04

Well, after his death, Dorothy moved the family back to Lancaster and remarried her first husband. His name was Dick Jonas. So I thought of the Jonas brothers like Nick. But his name was Dick.

SPEAKER_04 10:15

Dick.

SPEAKER_00 10:16

Dick Jonas.

SPEAKER_04 10:17

Dick and Nick.

SPEAKER_00 10:19

But that remarriage only lasted about a year. So then after that divorce, after she redivorced her first husband, she meets and marries Chalmer Milligan in 1963. Now he had two daughters. One was around Billy's age. No, one was Jim's age, and one was already grown and was a nurse.

SPEAKER_05 10:42

So a new rooster in the hen house, and everything's kind of shuffled.

SPEAKER_00 10:46

And everything's gonna go bad. Um now he adopted Dorothy's kids and they took on his last name, hence why Billy is now Billy Milligan. Now, Billy would say later on when he talks about everything, uh, that he already had three altars by this point. One was a little boy with no name that was there for him when he was lonely and wanted somebody to play with. So at first you would think this is just kind of like your imaginary friend.

SPEAKER_05 11:16

Right. So he's already creating things. I mean, we all had imaginary friends, right?

SPEAKER_00 11:21

So his dad's now committed suicide. His mother has already remarried and divorced again, and now she's married a third time to a guy named Chalmer. So he's going through some shit. That's a lot on a young kid.

SPEAKER_05 11:36

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 11:38

So first is boy with no name, and then Christy appears. Christy is a little girl, and she's British. As Christy is three and will remain three forever.

SPEAKER_05 11:53

Okay. That's that's the uh imaginary friend that he's created now.

SPEAKER_00 11:56

No, the no name was the first.

SPEAKER_05 11:58

Yeah, the second. Then Christy. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 12:00

So then Christy, and now another boy named Sean. Sean would be deaf, but we'll get into him just a little bit more in just a minute. So Dorothy was Catholic, but Chalmer, Dorothy is Billy's mom, if you guys haven't followed along just yet. So uh she was Catholic, but Chalmer was pro Protestant, and he required his new family to convert. There's another little bit of a trauma. That's a lot on a kid.

SPEAKER_05 12:29

It's a big change. So like everything is awry, and in the middle of it, he's trying to come up with like livelihood, but he's also creating, probably doesn't have any friends, really.

SPEAKER_00 12:38

No.

SPEAKER_05 12:39

And he's creating friends in his own mind. That way he has people to play with or something of the sort. So now this is the beginning of the salad in his mind. Um, it it's a lot to it's a lot to take in. And for for new for new bystanders that are are part of this podcast, is it's just who hasn't uh talked about and and yeah. This is kind of fun. Like, you're really gonna get educated as far as like mental uh uh just what can go on in your own mind. Yeah, the human mind is insane. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 13:13

So now that you know they've got to convert from Catholicism to Protestant, and they change schools and everything, okay?

SPEAKER_05 13:20

So passionately, right? I mean it's like full on you're moving from whole like versions of your religion passionately.

SPEAKER_00 13:29

So I'm just gonna well, and then also Johnny, you know, his birth father, he was Jewish. So that's like now you're the third, this is your third religion you're going into here. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_05 13:40

And all three of those are extremes.

SPEAKER_00 13:42

Extremely passionate. Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 13:44

Uh yeah, to take that in. And these and these guys they're they're kind of quiet over here because they're they're taking it in. They're they're focusing, and I love it because education, like as far as you're trying to figure out true crime and things that are really happening in the world and why they happen, why mental things happen in your mind, that's a lot to take in. The salad, that's what we call it.

SPEAKER_00 14:05

Now, Chalmer was super strict. You couldn't talk at the dinner table, you had to pass the dishes in clockwise. Am I saying that right? Yeah, clockwise, clockwise direction, you had to pass the salt and pepper like that. And um, if you didn't do that, he would be abusive. And then he would be really abusive when he would drink. Now, Billy's siblings would notice that he would often make buzzing sounds and really didn't know why. And um this would be when Sean would take over. Now Billy would later say that Sean was deaf. So the buzzing sounds would be how he communicated. Now remember, his family is experiencing this. This isn't as he said.

SPEAKER_05 14:54

He's doing it.

SPEAKER_00 14:54

Billy would just sit out loud, not speak, just making buzzing noises.

SPEAKER_05 14:59

So now he's solidifying somebody out loud that he's changing to.

SPEAKER_00 15:03

Chalmer, this is gonna it's gonna get rough for a minute, guys. Okay. Chalmer had a farm on the outskirts of Lancaster. And when Billy was just nine years old, Chalmer would start driving Billy out to this farm to sexually abuse him. And physically. Physically, sexually nine years old. Yes.

SPEAKER_05 15:26

Are y'all thinking about this right now? This is fucking horrific. It's insane.

SPEAKER_00 15:32

And he would tell he would tell Billy that if he said anything, he would kill him, bury him, and tell his mother that he just ran away.

SPEAKER_05 15:42

Yeah, and I I just wanted to speak on this just for a second. Um, to have this actually happen to you in this conversation has happened to me. And I uh trauma dump, right? I mean, uh it has I got full chills right now, and I wanted to actually put this on. And you guys probably have not had that happen to you, but this conversation is so scary, and if for you to create somebody that you're you're thinking in your mind that that didn't happen to, I understand. I I couldn't, so I hang on to that. And this is it's a it's a bad one, dude. You got me clouded up over here. I'm going to plant already. Lindsay, god damn it, Lindsay.

SPEAKER_00 16:27

Robert is there to protect you. Robert Plant. Now, Chalmer also became physically abusive towards Dorothy, and it was bad, like bloody nose. I mean, he was really abusive towards his family. Now, Billy says that he would start losing track of time, and this is the disassociative type thing. When you disassociate, you lose time. I I know this, I have disassociative issues myself. Like everything.

SPEAKER_05 16:56

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 16:56

Or it speeds up.

SPEAKER_05 16:57

One or the other. Yeah. It's just it it really does shift. It's insane.

SPEAKER_00 17:02

Now he would start getting in trouble at school for things that he didn't know he had done. Christy would be the one to take over when he would get in trouble. And then that's when she met Reagan. Reagan was the one that we talked about at the top of the episode. The next altar to appear was Arthur now. Arthur was a prim and proper gentleman. And when this altar would take over, Billy literally spoke in a British accent.

SPEAKER_07 17:32

Really?

SPEAKER_00 17:32

He appeared first to his siblings, and they were all on their way to school one day. And Billy, you know, it's Billy is the core, looked down at his socks and saw that they were mismatched. And then this British man came out of his mouth and said, Oh, I say, these are most certainly not mates.

SPEAKER_04 17:52

You destroy me right now, dude. I'm really fucking shook.

SPEAKER_05 17:56

I mean, I feel like, you know, when I what I just filled my whole soul right there. I'm destroyed right now because I wish that I had created somebody, you know?

SPEAKER_00 18:08

You might have, and you may not remember because you have a terrible memory, and that may be why you have a terrible memory because you lose track of time. I'm deeply destroyed in disassociative periods. Right.

SPEAKER_05 18:20

I'm really destroyed right now.

SPEAKER_00 18:22

So when Arthur, because he's appeared now, he's taking over the consciousness. That's what they call it. So when Arthur is taking over the consciousness, he arrives at school with these kids. He's a grown man. Arthur is a grown man in a little boy's body. And he didn't know what class to go to. And this was uh, you know, this was strange to him because he's a grown man in a little kid's school. And he is described, Arthur is to be an expert in science, medicine, and hematology. And he could speak and write Arabic, and this is for real.

SPEAKER_05 18:56

What a deep perspective and and accurate, probably, right?

SPEAKER_00 19:00

Billy, as Arthur, could literally speak and write Arabic.

SPEAKER_05 19:04

That's why I believe without being taught. I believe in reincarnation. Right. Isn't that crazy? And I'm gonna tag Jenny in this because I feel like I want her thoughts. I want her thoughts on it.

SPEAKER_00 19:17

Because I'm sure she knows about this case, because it's it was very famous in its time period.

SPEAKER_05 19:21

God, I'm gonna send it to her, and and we're tagging her in this. Uh this is at this point, okay. He has not created any crime.

SPEAKER_00 19:31

He's just no, those won't come till later on.

SPEAKER_05 19:34

So people to uh cope with in his mind, right?

SPEAKER_00 19:38

Well, and and everything's gonna kind of come together later on. Little spot, but I don't want to say it yes.

SPEAKER_05 19:43

That's why it hits so so uh so deep to me whenever she's like, Jesse, you get it. You know, Jenny was like, Jesse, you get it. And I was like, I don't fucking get it, but Lindsay, this is deep for me. And I I wish that I I mean, I don't wish that I was creating people in my mind, but I have been through certain things that you're already mentioning, and it's hitting really fucking hard for me. Hard. Uh keep on going, Lindsay. Uh oh.

SPEAKER_00 20:10

That day in school when Arthur had appeared, he aced a math test for Billy and in record time, and then he disappeared from the consciousness. Now, when Billy returned, he had no recollection of taking this test, and the teacher was certain that he cheated, but couldn't prove it. Like, she even says she like talks later on, and she's like, There's no way that he could have cheated because the only answer key was in my purse, and I had just like printed it off that day.

SPEAKER_05 20:41

You guys hear this? What do you think about that? I want to hear you guys. I mean, what are you thinking about that right now?

SPEAKER_01 20:48

Well, and what's crazy too is I mean, that's crazy though, because like a whole different personality took over and and aced the test for him.

SPEAKER_00 20:57

And it wasn't in his handwriting, but there was nobody else in class that would have done it for him.

SPEAKER_05 21:02

So nobody's he's switching to a different thing in his mind and creating and physically showing something different. What do you think about that, Alex? I mean that's crazy.

SPEAKER_00 21:12

I mean it's probably they're probably just soaking it in.

SPEAKER_05 21:16

Yeah, are they that I think they're both shocked? I'm shocked. I mean, yeah. I know this, they don't know this, but it is a real tangible thing, like physically, emotionally, mentally, spiritually, it it's a real thing. And you guys are just now experiencing this, and I'm glad you're part of this. I'm really glad it.

SPEAKER_00 21:37

Well, Billy, he would continually get in trouble throughout school because he's got these different people taking over his consciousness. And the school would even say on record that he looked like he was going into trances a lot.

SPEAKER_05 21:53

So this in between different people and doing, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 21:56

But of course, they this is the 60s. They didn't understand that at this at this point. Okay, so at age 14, Chalmer's been abusing Billy this whole time from nine years old. This time he took Billy out to the farm and abused him and made him dig his own grave and buried him most of the way, just leaving a pipe hole open so that he could breathe. And then Chalmer peed on him through this pipe, and all like all this fucking urine is just on his face. And this is when Danny appeared.

SPEAKER_05 22:35

Lindsay Nicole. You gotta eat, you gotta.

SPEAKER_00 22:40

Lindsay. This is fucking rough. This is one of the things. I'm telling you, this is one of my biggest fears. At the beginning, I just flipped the page. So yeah.

SPEAKER_05 22:47

I don't even want to go to the beach and let my son fucking uh cover me up in sand. That's my biggest fear.

SPEAKER_00 22:53

Mine too, and that's why I want to be cremated because I won't be buried.

SPEAKER_05 22:56

And just a few podcasts ago, you talked about somebody digging their own fucking graves.

SPEAKER_00 23:00

Two, two people. Yeah. Landsy. Well, and then we also covered the one about Christy Cole or Tiffany Cole. Not Christy Cole, Tiffany Cole. Where she, yeah. Go back and listen to that episode. Fuck. So Danny has now, he's he has appeared, and he would be forever 14. He was scared of everything, especially men. Now, after Danny, there was Tommy, who was an escape artist. He was very antisocial and he liked to figure out how things worked. He learned how to take Chalmer's shaver apart. This is an electric shaver, and dole down all the blades so that when Chalmer would use it, pull the hair, his face would be all cut up. Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 23:46

You're fucking destroying me. Dude, I have not stopped fucking crying over here. Have you seen me?

SPEAKER_00 23:52

Yeah. Jesse is crying to Robert the plant. Robert Plant.

SPEAKER_05 23:57

It's rough one. You son of a bitch, Lindsay.

School Trances And Hidden Skills

SPEAKER_00 24:02

Now, Adelaina, she appeared one day. Uh, that's the one we also talked about at the beginning, and we'll we'll explain more later on why certain things happen. But so Adelaina appeared one day, and she is, she's kind of like a homemaker. And she was washing dishes. And it's also said that Billy had very effeminate sides only at certain times. So he will have, so I think he has a total of hold on. Let me look at my list. I have written out all his altars.

SPEAKER_05 24:35

Yeah, you're you went deep on this. I went deep. By the way, everybody, Lindsay wanted me to just say this. This is Lindsay's number one first.

SPEAKER_00 24:45

Oh, thank you for reminding me as a podcast.

SPEAKER_05 24:48

She wanted to do this one. This was first on her list.

SPEAKER_00 24:50

Very first. It is at the top of my list.

SPEAKER_05 24:52

You have really got me fucking broken. And these guys over here are just fucking crickets because they're taking in something, and I I've I've experienced some of this. Nobody um at this table has um wanted to more than me. And so I guess Jenny says, you know, that you you understand because I I maybe I put something out on that podcast when we talked about her. I do. I understand. But I didn't I didn't separate myself. And I understand him separating himself. I mean, you go into school and doing all this shit, and you're you're you're trying to battle all the the trials and tribulations of school. Well, I'm just gonna put it like that.

SPEAKER_00 25:36

As being a kid and you're trying to uh Well, there's many times that Billy would return to the core consciousness after another alter had either gotten trouble or done something like that, and he's getting punished for something he doesn't understand. Himself. Sean would take over who's deaf. He's getting his ass beat for something that he doesn't understand. So yeah.

SPEAKER_05 25:58

So he's he's completely shutting off and then changing to somebody else to take on any drama or any traumatic thing. Y'all remember school? Fuck school, man. People in all your competitions and all your different emotions and trying to be social and trying to not be social at certain times and being uh accepted and respected and just livelihood and growing up and through fucking puberty and emotions and all the shit. Could you really fully understand being able to separate yourself from that and then being like, I'm blocking this off, and then moving on, you know? And maybe I do that myself in a in a smaller way, but I doesn't I don't name it into different people. Right. That's why you're like, you don't remember this? I'm like, no, I don't remember this, but I didn't I didn't have a name on who did.

SPEAKER_00 26:52

Right.

SPEAKER_05 26:52

Maybe that's that's that's part of me. Maybe she she understands that and Jenny Jenny saying that to me. Maybe she understands that because I do disassociate, but I don't have an actual person in my own mind. This is deep for me. This is really deep for me. Um, I mean, what do you guys think about that? I mean, you're taking all that in, and this is deep, right? This is your first really encounter with this, right, Alex?

SPEAKER_02 27:21

Yes.

SPEAKER_03 27:22

And to be able to shut off someone else, just like transfer over to a whole different person is insane. That has different traits. And I'm gonna have a different personality.

SPEAKER_00 27:32

At the end, I'm gonna list every single altar that he had and their different talents. Right. It's gonna be insane. Okay.

SPEAKER_05 27:39

This is gonna be long because I really want to project on on our our guest as well um all the mental things that are going on. I think Alex is fully understanding. Land is what do you think about that, Landon? I mean, what do you think?

SPEAKER_00 27:52

He's still he's still soaking it in. We're like we got a lot more to go.

SPEAKER_05 27:55

We got a while to go, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 27:57

So Adalena, like I said, she appeared, she was washing dishes because she would do more female type. He had three female personalities or three female altars. So Adelaina, she was washing dishes, and then Chalmer, he had just watched a video on how to turn a garden hose into a weapon, like a whip. You could beat the fuck out of somebody with a garden hose, and whipped her as she is in the consciousness now, and this made her forever hate men. And he would hang this garden hose up as like a warning to the whole house. A display. Like a display.

SPEAKER_05 28:33

Yeah, this is what you get if you fuck up, right?

SPEAKER_00 28:36

Now, Dorothy, she, his mother, Billy's mother, she is already noticing that there is more than one Billy. Now, the alter Alan, he would appear when some neighborhood bullies pushed Billy down in like a neighborhood pit and threw rocks at him. Like he was, you know, they were beating him up. And Alan, he was a he's described as a smooth talker. He can get him, get himself out of bad situations.

SPEAKER_05 29:06

Now he's just confidence coming out. That's just whole he's changing into somebody that he's confident.

SPEAKER_00 29:12

Well, confident, a smooth talker, yeah.

SPEAKER_05 29:14

So I get that too. I mean, people like flow into that naturally, and I'm sorry that I'm plugging so much into this because it's really deep for me.

SPEAKER_00 29:22

And it well, it it's been it's been on my mind. Yes. Like this this week has been a real this is crazy. This this research has really made me just question a lot of things. So I haven't said this, but I say it every podcast.

SPEAKER_05 29:35

This is the fucking most, this is the most horrific thing that you're building right now. And I say it every podcast. I don't know why I say this every podcast.

SPEAKER_00 29:44

Because it's a new thing for you every time.

SPEAKER_05 29:46

Oh my god. I'm excited for the next one, but this one's killing me too.

SPEAKER_00 29:51

Well, Alan, he tried to talk them out of doing this, but they did it anyway. So then Reagan, you know, he the Yugoslav, he took over. Now, when Reagan would take over, he would literally talk in a Yugoslavian accent. And he chased them with a pocket knife and threatened to stab them because Reagan is like, and I'll it'll show up more and more. He's like the ultimate protector. He's like the fucking John Wick of the Altars.

SPEAKER_05 30:20

Yeah, this is the dude in the six in this well, probably 70s now, right?

SPEAKER_00 30:24

No, we're not in the 70s yet. We're still in the 60s. Hold on, hold on. He was born in 55. So we're almost to the 70s.

SPEAKER_05 30:29

Okay, so he's in the late 60s, and he is his perspective of something in his own mind is a Yugoslavian gangster.

SPEAKER_00 30:37

Yugoslavian communist, yeah. Right. And he's got a good thing. And he has when he when Billy gets older, like Reagan's communist fucking beliefs like really shine through.

SPEAKER_05 30:48

So and is disassociating uh his his self into different personalities is his confidence in being able to be whatever is projected in front of anything that is um.

SPEAKER_00 31:00

Yeah, Reagan's Reagan's gonna fucking do the damn thing. So I get it. He he chases these bullies off with a knife and threatened to stab them. And one of these shitty ass kids told their parents that Billy threatened them after they fucked with him. Right. So then Chalmer beat him. Again with a nose. Yeah, just just for fucking taking up for himself. Right. Yeah.

unknown 31:26

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 31:27

Now, Dorothy, she's finally starting to notice that something is wrong with Billy. Later on, she will say that there was this Billy, and then there was her Billy, and the other Billy was the one that she didn't understand.

SPEAKER_05 31:41

Yeah, Dorothy has set her own children up for something fucked up.

SPEAKER_00 31:45

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 31:46

Sally Saladin, and I've been saying this forever.

SPEAKER_00 31:50

Well, she would say that he had been sleepwalking off and on for years, which is also a trauma response. And now he's starting to leave school. Like he's just getting up and walking out of school in a trance, and she would find him. Like they would call her up and be like, Hey, if Billy's just left.

SPEAKER_05 32:08

We don't know, we don't know why, we don't know what's going on. So at this point, he's snapping into somebody else and being like, Why the fuck am I in school? Because I'm a 35-year-old man and I'm stepping the fuck out.

SPEAKER_00 32:18

As a teenager, right? Right. And he's what he's just wandering the streets, and when she would get him home, he didn't know where he was, where his bedroom was. And then Billy would reappear into the consciousness, and he thought that he had just stayed home from school that day. He would literally ask Dorothy, Did I stay home today?

SPEAKER_05 32:36

Yeah, did I go to school today?

SPEAKER_00 32:37

And Dorothy would have to explain to him, No, you left school. I had to go find your ass wander in the streets.

SPEAKER_05 32:43

He's like, What?

SPEAKER_00 32:44

Yeah, exactly.

SPEAKER_05 32:45

Bet, dude, I can get this.

SPEAKER_00 32:48

Now, Arthur would start to figure out. So, like I said, Arthur, he's the distinguished Englishman gentleman. He would start to figure out that there are more people in Billy's head besides him and would try to communicate with the others. And that's when he met Tommy next. And then he would find 23 others. Now, like I said, Billy being the core, and then there's so there's 24 total.

SPEAKER_05 33:13

Yeah, Billy was really horrifically shot out. He just he was just trying to exist.

SPEAKER_00 33:20

Now, Christine being the first, basically, well, I mean, no name was the first, but Christine was the first one to have a name. Uh, she would start being able to read the others' minds. And it's even said that Christine was actually like dyslexic, and Arthur taught her how to read properly. So take out all the altars. So Billy himself, he's he's dyslexic, and he is able to teach himself to power through that. That happened to me.

SPEAKER_05 33:53

I'm dyslexic.

SPEAKER_00 33:54

I'm dyslexic, and I have taught myself how to overcome it. I used to reread book after book that I would read completely wrong the first time. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_05 34:07

It would go back and then.

SPEAKER_00 34:10

That's why I have literally reread many, many books in my childhood because books were my experience each time. Reading was my solace when I was younger. That was what that was my escape from literally reality, is I would just dive into books and I would read like my mom uh during the summertime. She would drop me off at the library when she would go to work. And so this is an eight, she had an eight to five job. She wouldn't pick me up till five. I would have read three or four books by that time.

SPEAKER_05 34:40

And when they were at like uh antique malls and things like that, you would be like, I want to find a book and hang out and do Lindsay stuff. Yeah, I told you about that. So many times, dude. You Lindsay, you and I have been through so many things, and we're the connectivity is so deep, dude. Oh. I get all this because I've been through all this, and I feel the whole dyslexic disassociating thing.

SPEAKER_00 35:07

I mean, I Well, we still I still struggle with it. Like when we're on a road trip and I'm helping Jesse navigate, I will literally tell him left while I'm pointing right. And I'm like, wait, no, no, no, no. Yeah, it's it's it's wild.

SPEAKER_05 35:20

No, I have to.

SPEAKER_00 35:22

Or he'll be like, Are you sure?

SPEAKER_05 35:23

It is so hard to be kiki ha in this, it's deep for me. This one's deep, dude. I can't fucking be kiki ha on this one.

SPEAKER_00 35:31

Now, school psychologists said that Billy would often not remember where he was, where his things were, and sometimes could not walk without assistance. His pupils would be smaller when these uh trance-like situations would happen.

SPEAKER_05 35:49

So he's physically showing something.

SPEAKER_00 35:51

He's physically showing difference.

SPEAKER_05 35:53

So it's mental to the point where it's actually becoming something physical, right?

SPEAKER_00 35:59

Yeah, and he would get into altercations with his teachers and classmates and just leave and once almost stepped out in front of a car. I'm thinking that that's what Sean was because Sean's death.

SPEAKER_05 36:11

So yeah, he would switch into that and not even he would shut it off actually in his own body when he when he changed into that. I I fully fucking agree with this. This is a real thing.

SPEAKER_00 36:21

I mean, Team Billy, all the way I mean, I don't agree with the crimes.

SPEAKER_05 36:25

Up to the time part, but I'm Team Billy, like, we're still Team Billy right now.

SPEAKER_00 36:31

I mean, we understand to the now he was he was sent to um you know a physician after this, after he stepped in front of the car. It was reported that he uh was diagnosed with psychic trances. And it was revealed during his, you know, his work with psychologists and things like that that he hated his stepfather and his home life in general. Because it was fucking terrible. Fuck yeah, it was. And Dorothy, she would confirm with these doctors that their home life was terrible and Chalmer wasn't nurturing. Now, Dorothy did not know about the sexual abuse. I will, I will, I will give her that. So mama didn't know. She had no idea.

SPEAKER_05 37:15

Fuck, but she the the hose was still presented in the fucking household.

SPEAKER_00 37:20

Well, and it said in the audio book that I listened to, which I'll plug later on, um, that Dorothy would cover that up. She would try to cover it up with coats and bathrobes and shit like that so it wouldn't be on Chalmers' mind to grab this and whip her for the house.

SPEAKER_05 37:35

No, she's thinking that they that this whole relationship and in their household is a good thing.

SPEAKER_00 37:40

Well, and I'm gonna let these boys know here that didn't grow up in this time period or a time period where this is a time period where abuse was accepted. And you're allowed to beat your wife back then. You're about to beat your wife, you're allowed to beat your kids, and nobody would interfere with your home life. Whatsoever.

SPEAKER_05 37:57

The cops would come into your house and be like, Well, you should have beat her. Right. That's literally what they said whenever there was domestic problems that if if they actually came, because women at that time would was was too scared to even call anybody, or if a neighbor did and was like, hey, this dude's beating the fuck out of his wife right in front of us, out in the yard, or whatever. Right. And then a cop would show up, and the cop would actually say, That's your husband, he can do whatever he wants. Exactly. Yep. So you y'all have to you're shaking your head in that, right, Alex? I mean, that's really what women went through. And all the way up to the probably 90s. Late 90s. Yeah. Can you believe that? What do you what are your what are y'all's thoughts on that? I mean, that's fucking crazy to me.

SPEAKER_00 38:45

And this is probably still a lot for two 20-year-olds are almost 21, but two 20-year-olds too 24.

SPEAKER_05 38:52

We get to partake in alcohol when you get older. I'm just saying, you know. Landon's over there like, but I got my green card on.

SPEAKER_00 38:59

Well, Dorothy would also let these doctors that were, you know, checking Billy out, she would let them know that Chalmer would throw Johnny's suicide in their face all the time and tell them that it was their fault.

SPEAKER_05 39:16

So he's blaming his fucking daddy's fucking own suicide.

SPEAKER_00 39:21

Her new husband is blaming Dorothy's late husband's suicide on them. And because there, he Johnny did write an eight-page suicide note when he passed away berating Dorothy.

SPEAKER_05 39:36

And being like, y'all are a piece of shit, and that's why your daddy fucking killed himself.

SPEAKER_00 39:40

Yes. Yes. And so this is a constant thing in Billy's life, in Dorothy's life. It's just always at, it's always there.

SPEAKER_05 39:48

This is so big, Lindsay. It's a fucking Mount Everest of a podcast here.

SPEAKER_00 39:53

And this is a time period where mental health was not really giving a fuck about.

SPEAKER_05 39:58

Because what they did with women all the way up until the 90s, they just put them in a sane asylum. And if dudes did the same thing, they would just be like, oh yeah, you're fucking crazy too. You know, we're just gonna put you in a padded room. That's what they did.

Psych Holds And Art Therapy Clues

SPEAKER_00 40:11

Well, the principal of the school recommended that he go, that Billy, that he goes to the Fairfield County Clinic. And during the interview, like, you know, the psychologists are talking to Billy, but it's Alan that spoke. Now he did say that he feared his stepfather, and he was afraid that his stepfather would kill his mother and that it would be all his fault. And this doctor would diagnose him with what's called hysterical neurosis. And this is he's now 15, and he was committed to the children's unit of Columbia State Hospital. And Billy, he just assumed that his mother chose chalmer over him. Didn't have any understanding. So Billy was um, he would while he's in this unit, he would be combative and violent. And it's even said that he attempted suicide there. And it's also said that this was most likely Jason who was present a lot during his stay at the hospital. And this would result in Billy getting in a lot of seclusion periods. Now, Jason would be described as one of the 14 undesirables of his altars. Now, Arthur went, like I said, Jason had Jason was an undesirable. Arthur would come in and take over, and he was able to make Jason disappear. But in many of the altars appeared at different times, and this would be later understood through Billy's artwork in art therapy while he was in this institution.

SPEAKER_05 41:54

So he had artwork and everything tied into that.

SPEAKER_00 41:56

Yeah, so I'm gonna go through pretty much all the artists in his mind. Okay, so Danny, which is the one that appeared when he was being buried alive, and Chalmer peed on him.

SPEAKER_05 42:09

That killed me.

SPEAKER_00 42:10

So Danny painted still life and refused to do landscapes because they reminded him of that instance. But Tommy, he would paint landscapes. Alan painted portraits, and Reagan would only do black and white paintings because he was colorblind. And I'm gonna show you guys some of Billy Milligan's paintings and how different they are. They are all on Google. I kind of want to buy one.

SPEAKER_05 42:40

She's so deep. Dude, we're buying one. We're definitely buying one. This is crazy.

SPEAKER_00 42:45

Not all of the altars would accept medication without a fight. Now, Reagan, he would take the thorazine that was prescribed to him, and Danny and David would accept the medication. One of, or they would take the antipsychotic medications because they were children. Well, they were younger. They were like, you know, mid-teenage age.

SPEAKER_05 43:06

So he's he's associating different prescriptions to different people in mind. Wow.

SPEAKER_00 43:11

Now one of the undesirables named Philip would appear when Billy lost his virginity to a female patient at the hospital. Now we already know that Billy has been raped. Now, Philip is described as a New York thug. Uh and like I said, Philip would tell this patient because she was wondering why, because he was hesitant. He was hesitant to be sexual with anybody. And Philip does reveal to this patient that he has been raped by a man.

SPEAKER_05 43:48

Right. His own fucking stepfather.

SPEAKER_00 43:50

Yeah. Now Dorothy, she would take Billy out of the hospital after three months against medical advice. But they did highly recommend that he needed outpatient treatment. And this is now we're in 1971 now, okay? Billy would start high school and did not do very well because the kids found out he had been in a mental hospital. He would be bullied by a group of girls who took his pants. I don't know how this happened, but this is in the book. Took his pants. Took his pants and a teacher found him in a corner crying.

SPEAKER_05 44:26

Now she went, she got his pants so he could go. Obviously, he's the weird kid, but they're fucking ranking him out and fucking with him even more. Which does not help.

SPEAKER_00 44:39

Now Billy made the decision that day to commit suicide. And he even left a note. But Reagan took over. Now his plan was to literally run off the top of the school. But Reagan took over and stopped him. And Reagan and Arthur decided that Billy could no longer have any control. And they put him to sleep. Like they put Billy's, the core consciousness, to sleep.

SPEAKER_03 45:09

They completely took over?

SPEAKER_00 45:10

They completely took over. Now Billy would get a job at a florist, but this was Alan. This was Alan that got the job. And Timothy and Adelena like this job as well. And so they would kind of go between those three altars while he worked there.

SPEAKER_05 45:32

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 45:33

Now they uh the owner um that you know really likes who he thinks is Billy. Now, so Ellen would ask if their paintings, because they they all have different, like I described earlier, they all have different painting styles. He would ask if their paintings could be sold at the shop so the owner could get a commission. And the paintings turned out to be extremely profitable. Like I said, I'm gonna show you guys some later. They're amazing. I don't know, but I bet they're fucking extraordinary mind-blowing when I look them up. All completely different from each other.

SPEAKER_05 46:11

Between different personalities. I mean, uh, Alex, you and I work in the same company, so could you imagine showing up to your company in a whole different personality? That would be be like, I'm a concrete guy, but I need to change my whole name and persona and mannerisms because I'm a concrete guy.

SPEAKER_03 46:28

That's who I am, where I'm at work.

SPEAKER_05 46:30

Right. And I did the same work that you've done. I'm a completely different person. Isn't that crazy? I mean, it's not crazy, crazy, like you're just associating things because of your trauma in life to exist.

SPEAKER_00 46:42

Well, most of these person, uh, most of these alters by now have figured out that they are called Billy. And so they just kind of played the part. They knew in their own consciousness that they have this whole different persona, but they accepted that they were called Billy. Yeah. Even even Christine, which was the little girl. Right. So they're completely different, completely different people. Unfortunately, uh, this shop owner decided to make a pass at Billy while he was in uh while the altar Timothy was present.

SPEAKER_05 47:19

So another male shop owner can't catch a break. He cannot catch a break. Salad. What we call salad.

SPEAKER_00 47:26

So so Timothy was present, and then Danny took over, who is the scared little 14-year-old boy that's been buried alive at that point. Remember all that? And he freaked out and just like kind of screamed and ran away. This made the shop owner literally close up shop because he was afraid of what would happen.

SPEAKER_05 47:48

Yeah, I mean, you don't make passes at fucking little, I mean, still a kid to me.

SPEAKER_00 47:55

Well, you gotta understand. Okay, so Billy has three, we've we've only talked about two of his female altars. I'm gonna bring up another one soon. He does take on effeminate characteristics while these feminine altars. So, which probably led the shop owner to think that maybe he is gay, which gave the shop owner um the confidence to hit on him. But these altars, all these altars are fucking scared of men, most of them, because of what Chalmer has put them through. So, and the younger one, especially Danny, who appeared while he's getting buried alive by Chalmer, shows up and is scared and fucking freaked out.

SPEAKER_05 48:39

How can you not be destroyed by everything that he's been through? How could you not be destroyed?

SPEAKER_00 48:44

I have been destroyed all week. Yeah. Oh my God. So, like I said, the clothes the shop owner closed up and Tommy, he appeared, he just comes back to work the next day and has no idea what's going on because he wasn't present during all of this. And then Alan took over, and like he's pissed off because this shop owner has also taken off with their paintings, these different altars paintings that are very good and very profitable and valuable, yeah. And meant a lot to these different altars. So Alan he gets them another job working at a nursing home. And remember, Billy's still a teenager, he's not grown yet. So he gets them, he smooth talks his way into getting a job at a nursing home. And that's when Mark takes over. Mark is an undesirable that is basically described as the workhorse. Like he just he likes doing repetitive work.

SPEAKER_05 49:44

The provider.

SPEAKER_00 49:44

Yeah. Well, he likes doing repetitive work.

SPEAKER_05 49:47

Right.

SPEAKER_00 49:47

And he likes he likes it to be routine. And uh so he would be the main one on scene for this job, but Arthur would also appear and soak in the medical knowledge. Like I said, Alan was a smooth talker and got them this job under false pretenses. And when the higher-ups found out that Billy was only 16, they let him go. Now, when Billy was 17, Tommy, who was the escape artist and one of the alters that like just kind of did some crazy shit, and he liked to learn how things were built and taken apart. He decides to build a dummy bomb and called in a fucking bomb threat to the school because Billy wasn't doing good in school. So this was Tommy's way of escaping the situation.

SPEAKER_05 50:37

So he's at the point now where he can associate with his disassociation.

SPEAKER_00 50:41

Not yet. Billy's still asleep.

SPEAKER_03 50:44

Still got him locked up.

SPEAKER_00 50:46

Billy's still asleep for a long time. Billy's not really there.

SPEAKER_03 50:48

They could just try to come out and just be themselves.

SPEAKER_04 50:52

Mm-hmm. You're understanding. Yeah. Full on, Alex. Thank you.

SPEAKER_05 50:57

You're grabbing it, dude. Oh. This is crazy, though. This is just fucking wild to me. It's gonna get more wild. I want to hear how Jenny thinks about this. I know, I do too.

SPEAKER_00 51:08

Yeah, I want to see what Billy's thoughts are on Billy Milligan. So, yeah. Oh my god. So, Billy, after this was all this happened, you know, the bomb threat and everything, he ended up dropping out of school and he joined the Navy. Now, this decision was made by Tommy and Allen. Billy had been in civil air patrol in high school. So he was able to rank in while he's in the Navy and became a recruit petty officer for the Navy and would be in charge of 160 other recruits. Holy shit. So he went right in and was a boss. Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 51:44

So in his mind, he can show up and shows up up then there.

SPEAKER_03 51:47

Right. Becomes a whole different person.

SPEAKER_00 51:50

But at home, yeah, yeah. He's yeah. But at home, Chalmer is still being very abusive to Dorothy. In fact, later on, when Billy kind of wakes up, the last memory that he had was of Dorothy when he was 14 years old. And this would be way later on, but we'll get there.

SPEAKER_03 52:09

So what three, three, four years later? Uh, about six. Six years later. He was like a completely different body.

SPEAKER_00 52:16

Completely, yeah. He'd wakes up and he's like, like he doesn't even recognize his mother. The last image of her was still a beautiful young lady, but she was being abused. And that's his last physical memory, according to what he says, that he has of her. So because this abuse, uh, this is still causing a lot of anger and depression in the altars, and they were constantly switching consciousness in between Billy, and his leadership skills were just inconsistent as fuck. Sean, who's still a deaf, a very young, very deaf alter, would even take over and he would put his shoes on the wrong feet and just show up for work. Yeah. And he's still making these buzzing noises. So his recruits are experiencing this now.

SPEAKER_05 53:04

Wow. Can you imagine showing up to work and being a completely different person in your mind?

SPEAKER_03 53:09

Being an army leader and not even know it.

SPEAKER_00 53:12

Right. So uh Billy would also be in sick bait a lot for his depression, and this chaos would cause him to start being observed by his commanding officer. Now, Philip, who was kind of he was the New York thug, he would take over and told his commanding officer just to fuck off. Like he's very combative, he doesn't get along well with this.

SPEAKER_05 53:36

So nothing's lining up, and he and everybody's just like, what the fuck's up with this dude? And he's changed into so many different people, and he's not actually expressing that he's changed into different people.

SPEAKER_00 53:47

No, because he doesn't know. Like none of this is recognized at this point in life, period.

SPEAKER_05 53:52

And he's leading people in this point in time, like military.

SPEAKER_00 53:56

He's leading 160 recruits.

SPEAKER_05 53:58

Yeah, and they're all like, what the fuck is up with this dude minute by minute? Yeah. It's changing.

SPEAKER_00 54:04

Well, after, you know, he tells his commanding officer to fuck off. He was honorably discharged uh for being temperamental, and they determined that he was unsuitable for further training. And I mean, this is probably for the best, obviously, because he wasn't diagnosed with anything. Oh, nobody knows what the fuck's going on.

SPEAKER_04 54:25

They're just like, this guy's whacked the fuck out. Why is he leading anybody?

SPEAKER_00 54:30

So he gets a ticket home, you know, he gets a severance, whatever that they do when you're honorably discharged.

SPEAKER_05 54:37

This is like Vietnam era, right?

SPEAKER_00 54:39

Yes.

SPEAKER_05 54:39

Yes. So he's training people for late, late Vietnam.

SPEAKER_00 54:43

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 54:43

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 54:44

Almost, almost ending 71. We're in 71, yeah.

SPEAKER_05 54:47

71, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 54:49

Uh so as Philip, the New York thug, Billy took off to New York. And when he gets there, he knows that he's from New York, but he doesn't know New York. You know what I mean? So Billy just kind of walks around in a daze, and then Alan takes over. And Alan is confused because he's got this one-way ticket to Ohio given to him by the military, but he's in New York. He's like, Why the fuck am I supposed to be getting the fuck out? I don't know what I'm doing. And I'm in the middle of this. But he's able to go to the airport and negotiates his way home. Now, if you listen to the book that I'm gonna plug later, it literally describes everything he would say and everything like he convinces them that while he's on this plane to Ohio, he was drugged and accidentally got off in New York. It's fucking wild.

SPEAKER_05 55:41

That's his own mental psychological. His own mental psychological, yeah. He's trying to come up with something to make something happen. Right. And he doesn't even understand because he has changed in from three other different people. Yeah, all the booms.

SPEAKER_00 55:55

So now Billy is back in Ohio and he becomes a vacuum salesman.

SPEAKER_05 56:02

A new guy.

SPEAKER_00 56:03

Yeah, he's a new guy. He's he's he's Alan again. He's Alan, like I said, Alan's the smooth talker. Alan gets them the jobs, right? So Alan uh is you know, he starts hanging out with this coworker, and this coworker wants to set Billy, you know, because he thinks he's Billy, up on a date. And he'll even tell these people, they call me Billy.

SPEAKER_05 56:23

The slick talker.

SPEAKER_00 56:24

Like he won't say my name is Billy, he'll say they call me Billy.

SPEAKER_05 56:29

That deep. That deep. Jenny, I want to know. I want to know all of your thoughts on this because we're sharing this to you. We really want some feedback on this. This is deep.

SPEAKER_00 56:41

So Billy, he decides he he agrees to go on this double date, Billy Ellis as Alan. Now, the coworker, he act, like I said, he acts like this is a date with just regular females, but it's not, it's it's sex workers. He hires two sex workers, and Alan, he's not really interested because he's still traumatized. A lot of these altars are very much traumatized from chalmers, right? So even though the coworker has paid for these two girls to have a good time with him, he rejects them. Now, this causes a fight between all parties involved and Billy as Allen, he wants to leave the scene and his co-worker, like the co-worker, so he they they've driven these uh sex workers out into the woods, basically. The coworker has paid for their services to be put on to Billy, who is Alan at this time. Alan's got the consciousness, and Alan's like, no, and he told them both, both these girls, that they didn't have to do anything with him. But this pissed off the coworker and was like, I paid them, and they were supposed to talk you into it, make it okay. So the coworker and Billy, as Alan, just take off from the scene. So a few days later, Billy and his co-worker were both arrested for kidnapping and assault because one of the sex workers had seen that the co-worker of Billy's had a rifle in his car.

Teen Years Jobs And Escalation

SPEAKER_05 58:18

So this is the first real charge that happened to him.

SPEAKER_00 58:22

Now the kidnapping charge would be dropped, but Billy was star still charged with assault and and and rape and was sent to the Ohio Youth Commission facility. So Billy and his altars, they would paint a lot, all of their different styles of paintings that I mentioned before. And one of his supervisors was so impressed that they started to sell the paintings. And this was this was not allowed. This was not supposed to be happening. You're not supposed to make a profit off of anything while you're in an institution, period. So the higher ups, they um they pretty much reached out to everybody that had purchased a painting and made them return the paintings for a refund after everything was found out. Wow. Other than this instance, Billy, he was a model prisoner and he was even able to be furloughed to go home for a visit. Now, when he goes home, he sees that Dorothy has finally divorced Chalmer, but she had a new boyfriend named Dale Moore. Now, Dale was much nicer than Chalmer, but he really didn't get along with Billy because he thought that Billy was a liar, because Billy would Okay, so here's an instance where I can No, I'm getting where you're going. I don't know. Okay, so Dale asked Billy, who is one of the altars, is is is present, got the consciousness. He's like, Do you want to go fishing? So then when Dale comes to come get him to go fishing, another altar is present, don't know what the fuck he's talking about. He's fighting with his own mind. And he's like scared, wondering what he's like, what are you talking about? I don't want to go fishing. So Dale just thinks he's this big fucking liar. Woo!

SPEAKER_05 1:00:13

Yeah, I knew it. And it's just like he's fighting with his own mind and having different altars that are like controversial mind thoughts.

SPEAKER_00 1:00:21

Because nobody knows what's going on in Billy's head. Nobody knows what's happening here.

SPEAKER_05 1:00:26

This is so deep.

SPEAKER_00 1:00:28

And what's crazy and and sad, um, so Dale had a son named Stuart, and Stuart and Billy really got along. I think the conscious who was I think it was Alan who was holding the consciousness. Uh Alan or Oh God. Alan or one of the one of the consciousness are holding, and they get close to Stuart. Now, when Billy goes back to prison after his furlough is over, Stuart dies in a motorcycle accident. So now another person that Billy has gotten close to. Billy's Billy, like himself, is asleep still. So, but these consciousness or these altars are getting close to this Stuart guy, and then he dies in a motorcycle accident. Now he loses another person.

SPEAKER_05 1:01:15

The emotional swing that you have put me through on this. I know. It's emotional swing, dude. I'm over here thinking about fucking just so much different, so many different things. It's it's it's insane to me. But but at the same time, I'm really fully grasping the concept of mental disassociating humanity.

SPEAKER_00 1:01:39

So I think Billy's in there for a couple of years. Yes. And he's released when he is 19, and his alters decide that it's time to live on their own. Now, the altars that knew each other came to an agreement that they were gonna keep Billy out of trouble, and anyone that wouldn't comply would be banished from the consciousness.

SPEAKER_05 1:02:03

So he's trying to be positive, uh a good person.

SPEAKER_00 1:02:07

Right. Now, Samuel, this is another undesirable, he was a Jewish altar who was banished for selling some of the artwork that the others had painted, and it was special to them. So they got pissed off that Samuel did this. And then Martin, who is another New Yorker and described as a snob, he had a fit on a golf course. Like I don't know what happened. He was golfing and he didn't make a hole at a certain par, and the people behind him that were waiting, like kind of got pissed off. So Martin threw this fit and now he is banished because he's making public trauma change changed his whole person. Because Arthur, who's pretty much the boss, Arthur's like, you guys gotta stop getting this out in the open. Like, we're not supposed to be publicly making this known that there are more of us than one. Try so kind of. Yeah, Arthur's trying to just keep it together. Yeah. He's trying to keep it together and make Billy a good person in society.

SPEAKER_03 1:03:17

Be a normal person, kind of.

SPEAKER_00 1:03:18

Right. But all these other, all these other altars are taking over that Arthur can't control. So he just he ends up getting like he he negotiates with Reagan, who's the Yugoslav. So he negotiates with Reagan, like, we gotta keep these fuckers out. Right. Keep them away. Shut them out. Right.

SPEAKER_05 1:03:36

Which all the personalities don't really click with the names, but at the same time, he is.

SPEAKER_00 1:03:41

Well, I'm gonna go, uh, like I said, at the end, I'm gonna list every single one and all of their talents.

SPEAKER_05 1:03:47

Fuck, I'm excited for that, Lindsay. There's no fucking way we're not leaving this podcast without buying some kind of artwork from this. Right. I want it in my house.

SPEAKER_00 1:03:57

Now, so now they're all living on their own. So Ray, so you know, uh, some of his altars are kids. And but Reagan, he he wants to own guns, he's a communist, he is kind of the a protector of sorts, and he likes to drink his vodka. So um he made sure that all that stuff would be hidden from them. So when he would hold the consciousness, he only knew where that stuff was. The children altars would not.

SPEAKER_03 1:04:26

Hiding stuff from himself, right?

SPEAKER_05 1:04:28

Right, right, right. And you would physically not even know as yourself where this actually is.

SPEAKER_00 1:04:34

That's the juicy deepness of only Reagan, when Reagan holds the consciousness, knows where his guns and his vodka are.

SPEAKER_04 1:04:42

Yeah. That's great. That's crazy.

SPEAKER_00 1:04:46

Now, April, uh, Adelaina, she would fight with April, who is described as the Boston bitch. And April had a deep obsession with killing Chalmer. So Adelaina would fight with April over the kitchen duties, but like I said, April's crazy. And she wants to lure Chalmer to their apartment, tie him in a chair, and burn him with a blowtorch. And she says that she would keep him awake with amphetamines to make sure that he is present through this torture. And with the blowtorch, she would amputate each toe, making him suffer on earth before he went to hell. This is what April has planned. So they banish April because she's considered an undesirable now.

SPEAKER_05 1:05:39

The conversations that has happened in whatever end that you're gonna fucking throw on us, Lindsay. You imagine sitting down with a one human being and them telling you all of this, and you're supposed to actually write it down and agree.

SPEAKER_00 1:05:57

Well, there's a book, and he it's all it's all out there. And I listened to it.

SPEAKER_05 1:06:01

So this is the biggest deep dive, I think.

SPEAKER_00 1:06:03

This is like what's crazy is I know an actual human being named April that would do some shit like that. Yeah. If somebody hurt her.

SPEAKER_05 1:06:13

Or her her children, yeah. Yes, the deepest I've ever seen. Like it's a lot. No, I say Royal Springs because like diving into Royal Springs and swimming. It's like 70 foot deep. Yeah. So you're you're you're you're trying to swim down and you're like, I'm gonna go as far as I can down, and the pressure of the water is what you're portraying on us right now.

SPEAKER_00 1:06:36

Well, for our listeners, Royal Springs is a spring that we frequent during the summer, and it's a beautiful area, but it is so deep that you're literally swimming above the water, and you've got scuba divers underneath you the whole time because it is five feet deep.

SPEAKER_05 1:06:52

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:06:53

Like they teach young scuba divers in this spring how to scuba dive. It's that deep, it's a perfect spot.

SPEAKER_05 1:06:59

No, uh, I'm just trying to uh explain the pressure.

SPEAKER_00 1:07:04

It's deep and it's pressurable, yeah.

SPEAKER_05 1:07:07

And it is. I feel like I'm just like because I like to try to go down as far as I can, which it's there's something deep inside of me, and I explained that to you the other day. But um the pressure of that is just what you're portraying on us right now, and Alex is following along good.

SPEAKER_00 1:07:27

I mean, Landon got Landon didn't feel good, so he's tapped out, but Alex is still here. Hey, buddy.

SPEAKER_05 1:07:35

And it's that deep. The pressure and everything that is so deep on uh humanity and somebody that has created so many different things that they're like they're starting to fucking get rid of things in their minds. It's this is deep.

SPEAKER_00 1:07:52

I'm just I've got a lot more than that.

SPEAKER_05 1:07:55

I'm a little sloshed at this moment.

SPEAKER_00 1:07:56

So now Kevin, another undesirable who liked drugs, uh, he likes the plot and he is a thief, and he comes out and he can he takes the consciousness and he started to to get into marijuana cells. Now Kevin was dating a girl named Marlene. Most of the male alters were told by Arthur not to have sex, to be celibate. But he never even but Arthur never thought to mention this to Adelena, who's a lesbian. So when things became physical with Marlene, it would be Adalena who took over. So now Billy was working another job, but it didn't last long, and Alan decided they should just move again. Like this is just an absolute chaos of a life, okay? So they move again. Reagan, he decides he wants to get more guns, and then Kevin, he hasn't been banished yet. So Kevin is deeper into the marijuana cells, and then Kevin gets into an altercation with one dealer where Reagan steps in because he's the protector, and he pretty much saves Billy, and the main dealer was so impressed with Reagan's fighting skills that he hires him as a bodyguard for narcotic deliveries.

SPEAKER_05 1:09:23

So you wake up in the morning and you see all this shit in your bedroom, yeah, and you're like, what the fuck is all this stuff? And you're like, oh, wait a minute, that's my other alter egos in my own mind.

SPEAKER_00 1:09:36

Because some of them knew each other, but some of them didn't. Like it's it's wild.

SPEAKER_05 1:09:40

You had to go so deep in your own mind to make some kind of presumption that that is acceptable in your own mind. You're like, I wake up in the morning, there's weed over here, there's guns over here, and there's other things like I don't understand, but wait a minute, I have to think in my own head. Right.

SPEAKER_03 1:09:59

And then the kids pull up the person that the kid altars pull it up.

SPEAKER_00 1:10:03

Yeah, the kid altars when they would show up, they would be scared, you know, of these of this type of situation.

SPEAKER_05 1:10:09

I want to go on the corner. Oh, you you switch to that, and the the kid altar is just like scared as like, but but your adult altar or your your your drug dealer altar or your communist altar or your British proper gentleman altar, yeah. They all speak to the kid and they're like, no, it's okay. I'm allowed to have this in my own room. You're good. And then you swap to that one and you go about your day.

SPEAKER_03 1:10:36

It's overwhelming. It's very overwhelming.

SPEAKER_00 1:10:40

It was very overwhelming writing this down.

SPEAKER_05 1:10:42

Yeah, no, no. The understanding, like what we're we're we're trying to all figure out, like waking up in the morning and seeing all this, and then coming to an understanding and then going about your day.

SPEAKER_00 1:10:55

Well, now, Kevin and Philip, who's the New York thug, they would show up from time to time and partake in the consumption of these drugs, and that was mostly barbiturates and amphetamines. Now, Philip, he actually overdoses a couple of times and has to have his stomach pumped. Now, I want to make sure everybody knows he's dating a girl named Marlene through all of this. Physically. In and out. And she just thinks that he's just this trouble guy that she can fix.

SPEAKER_03 1:11:28

There's a lot more than that.

SPEAKER_00 1:11:30

Yeah. No. So Arthur, he decides he's gonna take a fake passport that Reagan has acquired, and he wants to go to London. That's his that's his motherland. And he bought a one-way ticket. Now, when he gets there and checks into his room, he goes to sleep, and then Alan, he takes over, and he's like, Where the fuck am I? And he sees that he has a one-way ticket to London. He's only got$75 to his name. So Alan, who is the smooth talker, he goes to the airport and talks his way into getting back home to Ohio once again.

SPEAKER_03 1:12:13

He's the best smooth talker ever. He really is.

SPEAKER_00 1:12:16

Like he convinces them.

SPEAKER_05 1:12:18

You're in Europe and you've traveled all the way there and you wake up in a different personality, two different personalities, and you're like, what the fuck am I doing here, bro? I I got I got a little bit of money. Let me let me work my way back to Ohio.

SPEAKER_00 1:12:33

I mean,$75 was a lot more than than it is now, but it's still probably not enough to travel internationally.

SPEAKER_05 1:12:40

No, I wish I could go to London for less than$75 or back, whatever.

SPEAKER_00 1:12:45

Shit. So now we have a new alter named Walter who takes over. So they're back home in Ohio. Walter takes over.

SPEAKER_05 1:12:54

No, no, no. Oh, I just for that.

SPEAKER_00 1:12:57

I know that would have been great. So Walter, he's an undesirable that is an Australian big game hunter.

SPEAKER_03 1:13:05

What?

SPEAKER_00 1:13:06

And he couldn't find any big game, so he kills a crow. That's that's the closest thing he could find. Crocodile Dundee. So he is ban. Wait a minute, you call that a knife? So Walter is banished because he is now he's killing innocent animals for no reason. Oh, yeah. Unnecessary.

SPEAKER_05 1:13:28

So, like I said, this is so fucking crazy. I'm trying to grab something that's comical in the middle. I know.

SPEAKER_00 1:13:34

So Billy, he's still dating Marlene. Um and like I said, Marlene thinks he's just messed up. She thinks she can fix him. But she's not really dating Billy. She's dating a combination of Adelina, Tommy, and Alan, I think, are all the ones that are in love with Marlene.

SPEAKER_05 1:13:56

It's just diving off into this and being like, this person's worthy.

SPEAKER_00 1:14:00

But she does later say that, like, there would be times where she would tell him, You're you care about your paintings more than you care about me. Because an altar had shown up who didn't really know who the fuck she was. So they're just silent. They just go back to their easel and they paint.

SPEAKER_05 1:14:18

And yeah, it's switching in your mind, you're being like, Who the hell's this chick next to me?

SPEAKER_00 1:14:23

Who is this?

SPEAKER_05 1:14:24

Yeah, well, uh, whatever. And why are we here?

SPEAKER_00 1:14:27

Because, like I said, Arthur had instructed all of them that he knew to be celibate. So it's confusing for a lot of people that are showing up.

SPEAKER_05 1:14:40

She is strong. Like to to she's forcing herself on something too at the same time. She's like, I really want to make this person something that I can be with, you know, whatever in relationship. And he's just like switching between different people and was like some of them don't know her. Could you imagine that, Alex?

SPEAKER_00 1:15:01

I mean like Sean shows up sometimes and he's deaf. He don't know what he has.

SPEAKER_03 1:15:07

I can't even hear, and she's screaming at him or something.

SPEAKER_05 1:15:09

Yeah, like like conversations about breakfast, and she and then all of a sudden, boom. I don't speak, I just don't understand.

SPEAKER_00 1:15:20

Well, you know, a lot of his alters um didn't like physical touch, so they would come into consciousness when like they're being intimate or just holding each other, so they snatch back. So Marlene's now offended. Like it's you get it, yeah.

SPEAKER_05 1:15:34

It's crazy. This is I'm this a big fucking picture, and he's painting.

SPEAKER_00 1:15:42

Okay, so I'm about to get there. So Arthur says that it's time to break up. And because while they're with Marlene, there's a large what they call mix-up time. So they're losing time because some of these altars are kind of stealing time to be with Marlene because they love her, and Arthur's like, nope, more done. So he breaks it off. Now, while he's in that prison, like, while you know, for being accused of raping these sex workers, Marlene waits for him the whole time and dates nobody else. Fully faithful. And then when he comes out, he's it's not much longer after that where he's just kind of done. But that's all, Arthur. Arthur's like, we gotta stop this.

SPEAKER_05 1:16:35

He comes out, he's like a whole different person. She's never even really seen. I'm done.

SPEAKER_00 1:16:42

So now when Billy's altars are, or when his female altars have taken over, he does take on a more effeminate appearance. So he's at actually, this is Danny. I'm sorry, this isn't even a film female. So you're struggling.

SPEAKER_04 1:16:59

I love it. I am, it's a lot.

SPEAKER_00 1:17:01

I love it. So Danny is at a rest area. Danny's still a 14-year-old kid. Danny is at a rest area, and he is attacked by a man in drag because at this time, like uh I just want to go ahead and say that the uh audiobook that I'm gonna plug later on was written in a different time where um there's not there's some politically incorrect terms used. Yeah, I just want to go ahead and say that.

SPEAKER_05 1:17:31

Okay, fully his his physical persona does have a feminine aspect.

SPEAKER_00 1:17:36

So when his female altars have taken over.

SPEAKER_05 1:17:39

When he's walking around as himself, he has a female, uh, a feminine aspect. So there's a lot of attracting things that that are like, okay, this guy may be into me if I'm you know, but at the same time, this was uh a time period where gays were not accepted.

SPEAKER_00 1:17:58

Right. And um they kind of hung out around the rest areas to find companionship.

SPEAKER_05 1:18:05

As being closet, whatever closeted.

SPEAKER_00 1:18:07

You're trying to find closeted homosexuals, yeah.

SPEAKER_05 1:18:09

But you're trying to find that connectivity to somebody of your own interest, and there would be signals and things like that.

SPEAKER_00 1:18:15

We've talked about that in previous episodes uh in this same time period.

SPEAKER_05 1:18:20

As a feminine alter, you're you're gonna put that out.

SPEAKER_00 1:18:25

But this is Danny that's that's that's in his conscience holding the consciousness right now. So he's at a rest area. I don't know why the fuck he's driving, he's only 14. But um, he's at a rest area, he goes in, and a a man in drag approaches him and it said that he was assaulted by this person and another, and that's and Reagan, who is the protector, he takes over and he beats the shit out of both of these people and he steals their shit because he's like I'm gonna make it come up while I'm gonna make it come up while you assault and me.

SPEAKER_05 1:19:02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:19:03

Oh fuck. Now Philip, he takes over, and he's the New York thug. And he sees this as an opportunity to now make money. So Philip goes to his because you know, Philip's the drug dealer, he goes to his drug dealing friend and is like, I have found a new way to make money. And he feels like it's a victimless crime. Um, you will have to listen to the book that I'm gonna plug later to understand Philip's mindset, because I'm not gonna repeat these types of things that are in this book because it's not politically correct now.

SPEAKER_05 1:19:42

Yeah, we don't have two days to sp to speak on all this. This is a lot of things.

SPEAKER_00 1:19:46

So um so they start luring people in at these rest areas and and robbing them. They they they beat the shit out of them and they rob them and they take their shit. So, because they know that the people they are robbing are not gonna go to the police because most of them are closeted homosexuals, because rest areas were meetups in that time. Wow. And that's where I'm gonna shut that down before we say anything that's gonna offend anybody. Time period, not my fault. That is just what was happening.

SPEAKER_05 1:20:18

That was the spot where they were trying to get it. I get it.

SPEAKER_00 1:20:22

So um they also, uh, so this is Philip and Reagan at this point. They rob a drugstore and they are arrested for this and are sent to Lebanon Correction Center. So they're doing some time now. So Reagan is present most of the time in prison because he is their protector. But Arthur would come in and he would get them a job working in the prison lab, working with the doctors. That's what I'm saying. This is fucking wild. Okay. So he's got a job in prison working, and he's got the knowledge because Arthur was paying attention. So while Billy was still in high school, Arthur would cut classes to go read about books, medical books. Like he was just absorbing all this information. And then while Billy was working in that nursing home while he was too young, Arthur was absorbing the medical knowledge that he would like like see for his own eyes. Like Mark was the workhorse during that time period, but Arthur would come in and absorb the medical knowledge.

SPEAKER_05 1:21:33

Yeah, and I was saying, like, okay, Royal Springs deep, but this is Mariana trench deep. This is so deep, and the pressure between all the altars and everything that this is deep, and I just I feel the weight.

SPEAKER_00 1:21:51

This is, I think, the most fascinating case that I've covered so far.

SPEAKER_05 1:21:55

Oh, yeah, for sure. 100%.

SPEAKER_00 1:21:58

So Lee, who was an undesirable, he was a prankster and a comedian, like Billy's father. He would get banished because he was getting Billy into more trouble while in prison. I mean, and Billy literally would. But let's I'm gonna remind our listeners and Alex and you, Billy's still asleep. The core Billy, still asleep.

SPEAKER_05 1:22:21

Not there. Yeah.

Ohio State Kidnappings And Rapes

SPEAKER_00 1:22:22

Not there. Now, uh, Billy would get out on parole in April of 1977. So that's where we're at right now. We're in 1977. But then in October of that same year, that's when the crimes escalated. Like the ones I mentioned at the top of the episode. So he kidnapped an optometry student at gunpoint from Ohio State University named Carrie Dreyer, and he attempted to rape her. But when that didn't happen, Billy forced her to write him a check for$400 and rode around until it was cashed. And this was, I believe this was Tommy in this in the consciousness. But I like I said at the top, or in Alan and Reagan. So it was Reagan, Alan, Tommy, and Adelena, I believe, were all in the consciousness, flipping around.

SPEAKER_05 1:23:23

He's broken away from the horrific type people, and now he's grasping Philip.

SPEAKER_00 1:23:30

Philip. I'm sorry, Philip, Philip, he's the thug.

SPEAKER_05 1:23:33

So he's grasping the the uh the the criminal type personality in himself, yeah.

Arrest Triggering Rapid Switching

SPEAKER_00 1:23:41

Now um when when after he cashed this check, he left her in the car and he just went home and he did this same thing to Donna West and Polly Newton. And Polly Newton is the one who actually identifies Billy. And before the police arrest him, Billy, as Danny, called the police himself because when he took over after the last crime, he noticed that Reagan's gun was not hidden, and Arthur had instructed him that that, if that ever happened, to call the Bobbies, which is in British terms, the police. He told him to call the Bobbies himself.

SPEAKER_04 1:24:24

This is so deep.

SPEAKER_00 1:24:26

So he called the police, and something weird was going on, and at that same time, the police came to Billy's apartment disguised as pizza delivery and arrested Billy. Now, Danny is holding the consciousness right now as Billy is getting arrested. Danny is still the 14-year-old boy that has been buried alive by Chalmer.

SPEAKER_05 1:24:49

So no, he he is uh right in front of something that's horrifically horrifically happening, and he has nothing else to go to in his own mind. He's like, I'm gonna just shut down and go to this kid, right? Right. That way I don't have to accept adulthood.

SPEAKER_00 1:25:08

You know, and and everything that goes along with it, and also like blocking out all the trauma because one of the I can't remember off the top of my head, but one of the altars literally does that. They block out the trauma, so that's where time gets stolen and it's disassociating, yeah. Disassociating.

SPEAKER_05 1:25:28

Yeah, you're in the middle of something you don't want to deal with, so you're gonna switch into a different whole personality altar.

SPEAKER_03 1:25:37

Sit there and hold all the information of the bad things, right?

SPEAKER_00 1:25:41

Or or banish it away. Yeah, yeah, you're not going through it.

SPEAKER_05 1:25:44

Not have to go through it, yeah. Yeah, exactly.

SPEAKER_00 1:25:47

Now, while Billy, you know, the core as Danny is in the police car, it's on record that the officer says that he felt like he was talking to multiple people.

SPEAKER_05 1:26:00

Yeah, they're a switch in between all of them.

SPEAKER_00 1:26:02

Oh, yeah. Well, and also I listened to a couple of um psychiatrists that that talk about the same case where they said a person that has this diagnosis, the DID, when it's a highly stressful situation, it's gonna, they're just gonna interchange. Like boom, boom, boom, boom.

SPEAKER_05 1:26:22

And that's why I say they, because he is physically.

SPEAKER_00 1:26:25

He is a they, yeah, literally.

SPEAKER_03 1:26:27

Yeah. So then change and have a different story for the officer every time. Every time.

SPEAKER_05 1:26:31

Yeah. You can't put it all together because you don't know which one you're talking about.

SPEAKER_00 1:26:35

Well, you've got a British man, a Yugoslavian man, you've got British children, and then you have English-speaking children, you've got a deaf kid, you've that make buzz that makes buzzing noises to feel the vibrations in his own head. It's a lot. You've got females. You've uh I mean it's it's everything. So now Billy, he was still on parole from that previous arrest. So the gun possession alone was a violation. And then he was charged with four counts of rape. And I think, okay, so there's three victims, but there were four counts of rape. And I think that there was a multiple one on one of the victims. I'm not sure which one. Um, there were three counts of robbery and three counts of kidnapping. Now his court appointed lawyers. These were not high, these were not high-paid lawyers, these were court-appointed. They advocated to have him psychologically evaluated. Right. And he was sent to Harding Hospital. And this is when all the altars were coming and going. Like they're just blah, blah, blah. I mean, just in and out, in and out.

SPEAKER_05 1:27:38

Talking to somebody and being blasted by so many different personalities is well, and to an outsider, the psych these the psychologist, this was fascinating.

SPEAKER_00 1:27:48

This was something new. And you fully believe Yeah, because they're recording this individual trying to piece it together, piecing it together, right?

SPEAKER_05 1:27:58

And somebody's talking to you in your Like, wait a minute, you're somebody else now? Oh, yeah, I am. I'm I'm a Yugoslavian whatever. Right.

SPEAKER_00 1:28:06

And like I said, and he would take on the persona of all of these.

Forensic Evaluation And The Core Ten

SPEAKER_05 1:28:10

It changed his mannerisms and his whole personality right then. His whole traits of everything it snaps into different people.

SPEAKER_00 1:28:19

Now, the psychiatrist worked with him for about seven months before his trial and determined that there were 10 altars. Okay. So those core 10 altars were number one being Billy, the core consciousness. Number two was Arthur who was a British gentleman, and he was also an atheist. So and then there's Reagan, who knew karate. He was an atheist. He was a protector. He was criminal, and he was colorblind. Then there was Alan. That's number four. Alan was, like I said, he was the con man. He was the smooth talker, but he was agnostic, which is different than an atheist because you're believing in a higher power, but you're not religious. And he plays the drums. He paints. He smokes. He's close with Dorothy, Billy's mother, and he is right-handed. And if you put all the rest, we're left.

SPEAKER_05 1:29:18

If you put him in a band, he would probably fucking rock out on the drums, but never have played him. That's that's the thing that is so fucking hugely grasping to me. You know, if you put somebody in an altar state, they would actually be able to play them. They would actually be able to paint that. They would physically not see the colours.

SPEAKER_00 1:29:39

Well, Billy more consciousness, he held all of these talents as one, but each altar did things differently.

SPEAKER_05 1:29:48

Yeah, they would they wouldn't be able to see color or hear. They would they would be deaf. They would physically actually be deaf. They would just switch all of that would physically happen to this human, you know.

SPEAKER_00 1:30:01

So and also Arthur he smoked a pipe, but Ellen smoked cigarettes. Billy didn't smoke anything. The core consciousness did not smoke nothing. Okay, so then we've got Tommy, who is the escape artist. He's antisocial, he plays the saxophone, and he also paints. So he's also a painting altar.

SPEAKER_04 1:30:27

Oh my god.

SPEAKER_00 1:30:30

And now Danny, he's scared of men because he was the one that was buried alive by Chalmer, got peed on. Yes. He is scared of men and would never ever paint landscapes because, like I said before, the land reminded him of being buried. Right. Now, David, he is the empath. He absorbs all the pain and suffering. He is ADHD and always seems confused. Christine, she's the three-year-old. She would take the punishments for Billy in school. She had dyslexia, and she was also British. Christopher is Christine's brother, who is also British, and he plays the harmonica. And then there's Adelina, who did hate men. She was the 19-year-old lesbian. So those are the core 10 that are first discovered, okay?

SPEAKER_04 1:31:27

That's so crazy, dude. He's got a whole band.

SPEAKER_00 1:31:31

He's got everything, literally.

SPEAKER_05 1:31:33

And probably play better than fucking any harmonica player. I mean, just grab it up, never have done it, and play better.

SPEAKER_00 1:31:42

Than anybody. Well, and I'm gonna get to the explanation behind all that here.

SPEAKER_05 1:31:46

Blues travelers fucking vibes like coming out, dude. Holy shit.

SPEAKER_00 1:31:53

Now, Reagan, the altar, admitted to the robbery while he was in the, you know, he okay. So right now, Billy is being observed psychologically. He is now awakened. He does not know really what's going on. The psychologist is trying to fuse him with his altars to get all this information. Okay.

SPEAKER_05 1:32:13

Yeah, so they brought out the real him.

DID Acquittal And Hospital Commitment

SPEAKER_00 1:32:15

Right. Yeah. So Reagan said he uh he admitted to the robbery, and Adalena was responsible for the rape. But she said she was lonely and was just trying to feel close to someone, and these words were spoken to one of the victims. Those actual words. I'm just lonely and I just want to feel close to somebody. Yeah. Doesn't make it right at all. But that's what was happening. Okay, so Arthur had, like I said, uh previously instructed all the alters to keep their identity secret. But now that Billy was in trouble, it was time to make them known to possibly keep Billy out of prison again because he's already been in prison. He was in Lebanon. They didn't want to go back. They didn't want to go back to that situation. So the real Billy, the core, like I said, had pretty much been asleep since his suicide attempt in high school. Billy was diagnosed with DID, disassociative identity disorder, and committed to Athens State Hospital. He was acquitted for all of those crimes and the first one in U.S. history to be acquitted of crimes by reason of DID. Not insanity, but DID.

SPEAKER_05 1:33:36

Okay. I was just uh so he clocked out when he felt like he mentally committed suicide. Right. He was like, I'm done. Whatever happens after this doesn't matter to me because I have ended my own life.

SPEAKER_00 1:33:51

Now, this was a huge story, famously covered, widespread, everywhere. A lot of people did not like it. And I can understand completely why, especially the victims, because this was a new diagnosis. This was a new mental health disorder that nobody understood.

SPEAKER_05 1:34:14

And that's where Landon was setting at earlier. He was just trying to be like, there's no fucking way I'm not in control of my own self and my own mind. But I understand this, you know. And I feel like Alex is is fully getting us, right? With all the trauma and all the salad that we always say, there's a whole lot to grasp whenever there's trauma in every aspect of your life, and you're trying to disassociate, and that's what this is.

SPEAKER_00 1:34:43

Yes.

SPEAKER_05 1:34:43

Into completely another whole persona. And you're just trying to cope, you know, you're trying to exist.

SPEAKER_03 1:34:52

Just trying to keep living. Right. Without having those thoughts of everything that's happened.

SPEAKER_00 1:34:57

Well, while he's in this hospital, he while he's in Athens, um, he works closely with Dr. David Cole. And and Dr. uh Cole was able to identify all 24. And before I uh name the rest of them, many, many people were out for his story, were out for rights and everything. Even the author who had written about another case that we're gonna talk about later. I'm not gonna name it yet because it's gonna come later on.

SPEAKER_05 1:35:27

Oh, there's another one like this.

SPEAKER_00 1:35:28

Oh, yeah. And they had already made a movie about this case. So he finally finds an author that his authors all agree to work with, which is I'm opening my phone, sorry. Uh, Daniel Keys, who wrote the book that I listened to called The Minds of Billy Milligan. And it is a 15-hour listen on audiobook, and it's one of the best narrated books, audiobooks that I've listened to thus far for these cases. Wow. The narrator really pulls you into each one of these identities and makes you understand the difference.

SPEAKER_05 1:36:12

Yeah. So interesting. I just wanna I want to check all that out.

SPEAKER_00 1:36:17

The rest of the autars, the the others that are considered the other desirable, the undesirable, excuse me. So number 11 is Philip, the New York thug who does do minor crimes. And number 12 is Kevin, who plans and robs. Number 13 is Walter, who is the Australian game hunter, and who is very eccentric. He was banished.

SPEAKER_05 1:36:43

Yeah, oh Crocodile Dundee.

SPEAKER_00 1:36:45

All of these have been banished so far. So, and then we've got April, number 14, who is the Boston bitch, hates chalmer, but she likes sewing. She likes kitchen work. She's she's also a homemaker. Then 15, we talked about briefly uh the Jewish comedian who was also a sculptor and a wood carver. Then there was Mark, like I said earlier, who was described as the workhorse. And then there's Steve, who was the imposter. He had a huge ego, but he was banished. Uh Lee, like I said earlier, was the comedian. He gives zero fucks. He likes to get Billy in a lot of trouble while in prison. So Jason was combative and takes away bad memories and causes amnesia, which Arthur didn't like. Which is understandable because Arthur's trying to figure out everything and put it all together.

SPEAKER_05 1:37:45

No, you have put this all together. This is really a lot.

SPEAKER_00 1:37:50

It's very, it's very much a lot. And then there's either uh, so number 20 is Robert or Bobby, who is 17 and he likes adventure and dreams about it, but he has no ambition to pursue it, to pursue it. And like I said, Sean, he did he was ended up considered an undesirable. He was four and he was deaf and makes buzzing sounds. Then there was Martin, who was 19, the New York snob. Number 23 is Timothy or Timmy, who is 15, who is the florist and scared of homosexuals.

SPEAKER_05 1:38:27

I wish you had.

SPEAKER_00 1:38:28

Well, hold on. He was scared of the homosexuals because that is who was present when the boss at the florist shop hit on him.

SPEAKER_05 1:38:38

I wish you would have done this for Jenny, because I th I feel like you could break down a lot, and nobody would have to do it.

SPEAKER_00 1:38:45

Uh there wasn't as much information on Jenny. No. So yeah. So I I'm waiting on more information for Jenny. I would love to recover her case.

SPEAKER_05 1:38:54

Uh her um documentary this that's coming out, I think it's already out. I don't know if it's out.

SPEAKER_00 1:38:59

And she even told us in a message that there's more to the story that has not been put in public eyes. So that would be.

SPEAKER_05 1:39:05

We're waiting for that. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:39:07

I will redo Jenny as long as I have all of her support.

SPEAKER_05 1:39:10

Yeah, and an off off uh off script. We we talked to Alex about her him finding um Jenny in our podcast and looking deep into that because we need both aspects as far as uh victim and criminal, whatever. The whole salad of this and putting it all together and being able to do what you're doing.

SPEAKER_00 1:39:33

Well, outsiders are experiencing this man, Billy, the core consciousness, being multiple people, but they don't understand it.

SPEAKER_05 1:39:42

And Billy himself does not even understand it. No, no, he's just like, what the fuck am I doing here about?

SPEAKER_00 1:39:47

Now, here is where I'm about to fuck your mind. No, I don't want anymore. So, number 24. This is the teacher who is the actual age of Billy and is the core consciousness that taught everything to everyone else because Billy was actually born a child prodigy. And because of the abuse that he suffered, his mind fragmented, and he was not able to be the person that he was born to be, honestly.

SPEAKER_05 1:40:26

No, that's his consciousness.

SPEAKER_00 1:40:28

Because, okay, so Alex, do you understand what a prodigy is?

SPEAKER_03 1:40:32

Yeah, super genius type person.

SPEAKER_00 1:40:35

Right. So they're literally born with the knowledge of things that it takes many years for us to like normal people to understand. Like I consider just I consider Jesse a a kind of uh prodigy when it comes to music because you don't you you don't have to read it, you can just hear it. And our son does the same. And I was the same. Now, once I started reading music, like I learned how to read music, and then it was easy for me to play other instruments that had the same type of notes or melodies or things like that.

SPEAKER_05 1:41:12

I mean, you're a podcast prodigy, you know, saying you you this research and everything you're putting together is is something that's different than people can actually physically do without years of it, and you do it naturally, you know? You're very good at it, you know.

SPEAKER_03 1:41:28

This guy can have just a whole different personality. Take up the whole guitar and just yeah, so yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:41:33

I mean, he's he's play he plays the sacks, um, the harmonica, the drums, and he paints. And I just uh off mic, really quick. I just showed Jesse and Alex both his different styles of paintings, and they're all different.

SPEAKER_05 1:41:48

Very talented, better than most people that do that as a career. The same as if he played a harmonica, he would probably be better than most people that do that as a living, you know, and have practiced for years. Yeah, right. Saxophone better than the dude without the shirt, whatever his name is with all the muscles.

SPEAKER_00 1:42:09

Kenny G? No, what I know what you're talking about.

SPEAKER_05 1:42:13

On uh Lost Boys. Yeah, we seen him at uh one of the cons.

SPEAKER_00 1:42:17

We saw him at uh at Spookala. Yeah, and I was like, there's the guy that does the Well, that's different.

SPEAKER_05 1:42:26

Well, but I was like, whatever that guy is on, you know, I was like that that guy was on a George Michael song. Oh, whatever.

SPEAKER_00 1:42:34

I mean, whatever, but still like, yeah, that guy, that guy, that guy.

SPEAKER_05 1:42:38

I'll do some sacks saxophone. I love it. I'm drunk.

SPEAKER_00 1:42:43

But um So after the teacher pretty much it, which is the fused Billy, everybody's fused together and are able to tell their story, um, they get it all out there, okay? So Arthur, he tells Dr. Call that Billy, like I said, was an you know a child prodigy. And due to the horrible trauma, he did fracture and split off into many things. And by the way, the movie Split that we like, this is based off Billy Millie. What? Yeah, what? Because he was a criminal, but there were you you even seen in the movie too that there were certain aspects of him that did not want to be that criminal. So that was that's portrayed. So if you haven't watched Split, Alex, definitely watch that. Yeah, so him as it's a horror movie, yeah, but it's interesting, interesting, right?

SPEAKER_05 1:43:41

Him as his self does not want to be part of this, but it's all fucking really happening.

SPEAKER_03 1:43:47

His other personalities can just take over to happen.

SPEAKER_05 1:43:50

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:43:50

Now, of course, there are a lot. There's this is like literally split in half of people that support this theory and the people that rebuff it. Because this is a person that pretty much got away with criminal activity because of their disability. Um, but at the same time, he did spend over 10 years in um mental hospitals. And unfortunately, while he's so he's got one doctor that he works with closely that understands him, that believes him. Then when he gets transferred to another hospital, there's another doctor that does not believe him and that pretty much fucking hates him.

SPEAKER_03 1:44:34

Don't know what to diagnose him with.

SPEAKER_00 1:44:36

Well, he diagnoses him with schizophrenia, so he puts him on a medicine that makes him split even more.

SPEAKER_07 1:44:42

Oh man.

Release Debate And Later Suspicions

SPEAKER_00 1:44:43

So it's just constant fucking everything. And Billy gets in trouble because he's not, when he's working with different doctors, the one doctor, you know, gets him to kind of fuse, and then other doctors pretty much cause him to split more. So in those situations, he's getting into more trouble. He's having relationships and relations with other um inmates, or not, I guess inmates, uh, is what you would call them, because it's a it's a low-level security. It's a low-level security mental hospital that you're that he's been sentenced to like indefinitely. There's not there would uh when he first gets um acquitted of these crimes, he's still sentenced to this mental hospital, and it's an indefinite time period, but it does end up being over a decade.

SPEAKER_05 1:45:33

Yeah, so his mental and awareness like capabilities are starting to string off into other people to succumb to his livelihood.

SPEAKER_00 1:45:45

It's why like everything is wild, and I'm like I said, I'm on the fence about his punishment. I don't think he should ever be released, which he does get released in 1988, and uh then in 1991, he was completely discharged from the mental health system and courts period. That means he was no longer being treated, and I don't agree with that at all.

SPEAKER_03 1:46:08

He just leaves with more people in his head.

SPEAKER_00 1:46:10

Right now, he does he gets married, um, he lives a pretty, it seems like quiet life for a while in California. He bought a production company called Stormy Life Productions, where he was to make a short film, but that never happened because he's still split, he's not completely fused, and that's why I feel like that for the remainder of his life he should have remained in these institutions because there were two other murders that happened that he was suspected of. It's never been proven, but it doesn't seem like it. There's not a lot of information on those, so I apologize. That's pretty much all I can give our listeners and you guys that there were two murders that happened after that he might have been tied to or he does escape the mental institution at one point and he goes under an assumed name, uh, which is Christopher Carr. So the story doesn't end after this book. This book that I listened to was written and published and everything while he was still in these institutions, but he was released and he was released from the system completely, and we just don't know.

SPEAKER_05 1:47:30

So savant autistic.

SPEAKER_00 1:47:33

I don't think he should have ever been released. I think he should have been studied for a very long time until the end of his life, which would be in 2012 when he passed away from cancer at 59 in Columbus, Ohio.

unknown 1:47:48

Wow.

SPEAKER_05 1:47:49

I'm just trying to put it all together. I I'm thinking of Savant Autistic, and he just has so many different avenues to go through trauma in his life, and he's created something many avenues, yeah. Like as his mental existence and physical existence, it it has something to do, like all of it really ties into some kind of autism.

SPEAKER_00 1:48:12

I I don't know if that it ties into what Jenny had going on, but like disassociating well, Jenny, I believe, was completely and this is my thoughts, and and Jenny can literally just completely blow my thoughts out of the water. This is just my humble opinion. I believe that Jenny's splits were completely caused by her trauma, and so was Billy's, but Billy was born a savant, a prodigy who had many talents under his belt that he did produce and profit and gain profit from throughout his life. Right. Unfortunately, some of those talents were illegal, and some of those talents were amazing.

SPEAKER_03 1:48:56

He was sitting there painting as one person, and another person sat there and sold off his other paintings.

SPEAKER_00 1:49:01

And selling drugs. And then some were doing drugs.

SPEAKER_05 1:49:05

And it's just Yeah, to wake up and be like, why do I have$500 in my wallet right now?

SPEAKER_00 1:49:10

That's literally part of the book. Literally, really, literally in the book. Wake up and have a roll of money. Like he one of these splits actually learned how to make fake acid and bankrolled off that shit.

SPEAKER_05 1:49:27

It's and other words trying to chad Jenny into what she went through versus this, because it's it's all different aspects, but at the same time, we don't have anything to bounce off from. This is the only thing that we can bounce off from. So check out Jenny Haynes as well. That's her our number one podcast, right?

SPEAKER_00 1:49:45

Yes, it's our number one episode, number one listened episode.

SPEAKER_05 1:49:48

Her stories and watch all of her documentaries and things that you've seen. Uh, there's a there's a was it 60 Minutes in Australia. 60 Minutes Australia. So I mean check out all of her stuff as well and she has a book in.

SPEAKER_00 1:50:00

Out as well that I don't have off the top of my I think it's the girl in the green dress. I remembered it. Remembered it? I remembered it. Girl in the green dress. Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 1:50:08

Um, we support her, we sent her merch, and she um actually has responded to us. And I hope that after after this, we can send it to her and she can maybe come back with a little bit more insight.

SPEAKER_00 1:50:19

What her thoughts are on that.

SPEAKER_05 1:50:21

Exactly.

SPEAKER_00 1:50:22

And with her permission, we may share them with you guys. Yes. If she doesn't want to, we won't.

SPEAKER_05 1:50:26

Sorry. We will share it if she she gives us some feedback. And and I I always love contacting and um being able to support all the information that survivors have been through. Whether you know um, have different different personalities or whatever this is this is just uh something that I want to really grasp into. And being able to use this platform to bring awareness is amazing. Lindsay, thank you so much for your story.

SPEAKER_00 1:51:00

Well, I just want to repeat really quick because I don't know if I said it correctly. So he was he was diagnosed in 2012 with cancer, and he passed away in uh on December 12th, 2014. I just wanted to make sure I put that out there. And it was said that he was living on um Katie's property.

SPEAKER_05 1:51:16

So every bit of that is just something we can his sister's property, really look deeply into and try to get awareness for mental stability.

SPEAKER_00 1:51:24

And then the book, um, really quick, because because it is just uh absolutely fascinating, is The Minds of Billy Milligan, um, written by Daniel Keyes, and I need glasses and I cannot see the author, but the author, the narrate, I'm not the author, but the narrator really does an amazing job of helping you understand all these different characters that played in Billy's mind.

SPEAKER_05 1:51:51

Which is a whole thing that we did not talk about. What made you feel old this week?

SPEAKER_00 1:51:55

We did not talk about that. So um Chuck Norris just passed away, Jesse. Man, I heard about that. Oh Chuck motherfucking Norris 2026 took Chuck Norris. So I'm literally now scared of 2026.

SPEAKER_05 1:52:11

So my old is I had a guy that was Gen X that was teaching me something to do with technology, and I didn't even know it. So I'm like a millennial. Elder? We're millennial boomers. We're elder millennials. And a Gen X dude is teaching me something on technology, and he's like, you know, you just you do this, you do that, whatever. I was like, fuck, I didn't even know that. And he's like, You're a boomer.

SPEAKER_00 1:52:41

Well, I teach Silas stuff because and he's Gen Alpha, but everybody needs to be taught, you know.

SPEAKER_05 1:52:48

I was taught by a Gen X. I mean, they created everything that we love, right? Yeah, literally.

SPEAKER_00 1:52:53

Thank you, New Metal. We love it. Yeah, thank you for that.

SPEAKER_05 1:52:56

Gen X really did. Um, we're doing everything because of what they created.

SPEAKER_00 1:53:01

And the best rap ever.

SPEAKER_05 1:53:03

Oh my god.

SPEAKER_00 1:53:04

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 1:53:04

So we stopped there. But we we we worship Gen X, but at the same time, this guy's making me feel like I'm older than him because I don't understand what the fuck he's doing. I'm supposed to know it.

SPEAKER_00 1:53:15

Like, what, dude?

SPEAKER_05 1:53:16

Like, come on, dude. I I felt old by a guy that's older than me.

SPEAKER_00 1:53:20

Well, I mean, you gotta remember too, though, that like, even though we're elder millennials, Gen X was at the dawn. They were uh teenagers and adults at the dawn of the technology that we are now literally that we have that we need to survive. And they can still teach us a lot. Now, boomers, I'm still teaching them.

SPEAKER_05 1:53:43

They can turn on the computer and they and it says, You've got mail. Gen X, made that happen. Alex, what made you feel old this week? I just wanted to know what happened.

SPEAKER_03 1:53:56

Carrying that bucket up and down the hill.

SPEAKER_05 1:53:58

That bucket.

SPEAKER_03 1:53:59

The bucket full of mud.

SPEAKER_05 1:54:01

Oh, that mud that I bought you? Yeah. Yeah, all them concrete bags that are 90 pounds apiece. Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:54:06

Yeah, I left you then construction. Well, road construction.

SPEAKER_05 1:54:10

No, he toted the uh concrete that I bought him. They're like, dude, I need a pallet of concrete dropped off at my job, and Alex toast that shit 90 pounds apiece in a bucket. That you had to mix up with water.

SPEAKER_00 1:54:24

Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_05 1:54:25

And you had to pack it into something. That's cool. I mean, I bet you.

SPEAKER_00 1:54:28

You were like Jack and Jill going up a hill fetching a bucket of water in Middleburg.

SPEAKER_05 1:54:34

But it was a bucket of concrete. Yeah, bucket of concrete. No, I I get it. That bucket probably weighed a hundred pounds, and you're toting the shit out of that all week long. I mean, you feel old. How old are you, Alex? You're like 20. You're 20.

SPEAKER_00 1:54:48

About to be 21.

SPEAKER_03 1:54:49

Oh, just in a couple weeks. Yeah. Uh what is it, the 20th?

SPEAKER_00 1:54:54

Today is hold on, the 21st.

SPEAKER_05 1:54:57

So you get to drink about something next episode. Well, we won't we won't tell nobody about that.

SPEAKER_03 1:55:09

I can fight for my country, but I can't even drink.

SPEAKER_05 1:55:11

Right. Yeah. Well, next fucking podcast, you damn sure can. Yeah. Uh you might be now, but we don't give a fuck at this point. Lindsay. No comment.

SPEAKER_04 1:55:22

Lindsay. Thank you, Lindsay.

SPEAKER_05 1:55:24

I just wanted to say thank you. Because thank you, Lindsay. For bringing awareness to everybody. And we need to do one of these at least every season.

SPEAKER_00 1:55:37

Yeah, so there will be another one next season. And I just want to say, for the record, there are many people that do not agree with this. I've actually listened to I listened to three other podcasters who think that Billy is an actual con man. And I respect their opinion. I understand completely. But as a person who's gone through trauma, and as a person who has deep dived into situations like this, I do think that the split is real. I don't want to excuse the crimes by any means, and I don't think that Billy should have ever been released from mental hospitals.

SPEAKER_05 1:56:15

No, he's not ready for society.

SPEAKER_00 1:56:17

But at the same time, he did not commit any crimes past the time that he was released. Since 1991. No, it was the splits in his head. And I just I I I just want to make make sure that everybody knows that we do not support crimes by anybody at all. No matter what their diagnosis is. How do you wind up in Great Britain? Right.

SPEAKER_05 1:56:46

And not know what the fuck you're doing and then want to go back to Ohio.

SPEAKER_03 1:56:50

I believe he had them.

SPEAKER_05 1:56:52

We believe. We believe it. You're probably more accurate, Alex, over there, because I think it was way more than what they actually portrayed.

SPEAKER_03 1:57:03

Yeah, it could have been 60, 70, 30.

SPEAKER_00 1:57:06

And then, like I said, like, I mean, we believe a woman who had 2500, like, wholeheartedly believed everything. Because what that woman went through is beyond most of our comprehension.

SPEAKER_03 1:57:24

Yeah, and they were changing between 10,000 plus consciousnesses in your brain. Just call it that.

SPEAKER_05 1:57:30

Definitely check out what Jenny has going on because like it can change when you're at that mental level with every emotional swing. You can every emotional swing. You you got it. You got it literally. You don't know what you're gonna come up with whenever I stand up and and feel a different way. I'm gonna disassociate that and try to cope with it.

SPEAKER_00 1:57:54

And outstand outsiders understood because they I mean, that I'm not gonna say they understood, but they seen changes in him throughout his whole life.

SPEAKER_05 1:58:04

Completely. Writing, emotional, physical, it happens right in front of you. They snap right into something different as every emotional swing, and they have to be able to pull that up, and Jenny and him being able to pull that up in front of you in conversation proves it. You know, mentally, it really proves the full physical aspect of changing everything about your physical being, you know, and and him being able to leave after he thought he he had committed suicide, disassociated everything from then on, you know.

SPEAKER_03 1:58:43

He probably went to do some even more crazy stuff after.

Books And Documentaries To Continue

SPEAKER_00 1:58:46

Oh yeah, there's there's there's much more to the story, but we would have been here for days, literally. So I do encourage, like I said, um you guys listen to or read the book The Minds of Billy Milligan by Daniel Keyes. It is so the audiobook is on Spotify. It is 15 hours long, but it will be one of the most interesting things that you'll ever listen to in your life. But if you are a reader and you have the time to sit down and read to read it, like period, if you listen to the audiobook, you can understand, in my opinion, a little bit better because the narrator does take on the persona of each one of these personalities that would take over consciousness so that you can understand the difference in the people that were living in Billy's head.

SPEAKER_05 1:59:39

Way deeper than Hollywood, yes. Way deeper out.

SPEAKER_00 1:59:42

And I have Oh, and there's a four-part documentary on Netflix as well.

unknown 1:59:46

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:59:47

I forgot to plug that. Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 1:59:48

Thank you, Lindsay. I mean, this is amazing. I have a band though. Can I play a band? Can I get away?

Palette Cleanser Band Dead End

SPEAKER_00 1:59:54

Yes, what palette cleansing band are you do you have for us today? I just want to get away.

SPEAKER_05 2:00:00

I just want to get away from the whole thing and play some music. Lindsay. Change the vibe. It is time for the palette cleanser, and I just cannot wait to share this band with you, with Alex. Lannon has fucked off because I think he was.

SPEAKER_00 2:00:18

Oh, I've heard of this band.

SPEAKER_05 2:00:20

He was a little bit uh Lannon was a little bit uh he couldn't take it in. He was just like, I'm going away.

SPEAKER_00 2:00:26

And which is understandable, it's a lot. And he went through some trauma in January that he's still not completely healed from. So yeah.

SPEAKER_05 2:00:34

And I was trying to give him that platform in the middle of this, and we're gonna share this later on because Lannon did go through some shit. And it's his story to tell, not ours, so we will let him do it when he's ready. So maybe this is a little bit too much for Lannon, but um, Alex, thank you so much for being here. Lindsay, fuck you, because you have fucked me again this week.

SPEAKER_03 2:00:57

It was great, but a lot.

SPEAKER_05 2:00:59

It was I want to play her last sight. I'm saying that one more time. Her last sight, and they're from um, they're from Israel.

SPEAKER_00 2:01:10

Oh, wow.

SPEAKER_05 2:01:12

An Israeli band.

SPEAKER_00 2:01:13

So that's our first one, right?

SPEAKER_05 2:01:15

Yeah, yeah. This is, and I want you guys to check this song out. This song, Lindsay, is called Dead End. Alex, you're gonna fucking love it. Lindsay, you're gonna fucking love it. Here we go. What do you fucking think about that shit?

SPEAKER_00 2:06:00

That's my shit right there. What did you think, Alex?

SPEAKER_03 2:06:04

That was a great song. Yes, they jammed, they beautiful.

SPEAKER_00 2:06:08

So I have uh done my admin work while the song was playing, and I have followed them on Spotify and Instagram. So on Instagram, uh, they said that they also, so we featured this song, which is called Say It One More Time, Jesse.

SPEAKER_05 2:06:22

This is song was called Dead End.

SPEAKER_00 2:06:25

And so they have their latest song uh that they are advertising on their Instagram is Danny Called Me a Cowboy King, which I'm also gonna share in our stories, as well as this song.

SPEAKER_05 2:06:44

They're from fucking Israel. I love being able to share bands from all over the world, dude. It's so amazing.

SPEAKER_00 2:06:50

Well, what I have noticed is that a lot of the bands that we share are followed by other bands that we shared, and this band is followed by Aurora Aurora Wave, who we are very proud to have shared on this on this podcast. Very, thank you so much, Aurora Wave. Thank you so much to all the bands that give us permission to play you on our very small time hobby uh podcast. We appreciate you so much. This was this is my dream. I wanted to talk about true crime, and I wanted to share music that is up and coming because we are passionate about both.

SPEAKER_05 2:07:27

Yeah. Monetarily, though, we don't get any money off all. No, we're completely a hobby. I feel like we're getting pretty close to maybe season three. We're in season two now.

SPEAKER_00 2:07:37

We may be making some money by season three.

SPEAKER_05 2:07:39

And I'll have to restructure this.

SPEAKER_00 2:07:41

Yes, this is episode seventy-three.

SPEAKER_05 2:07:44

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 2:07:44

And um, season three will start at our hundredth episode.

Social Links Thanks And Sign Off

SPEAKER_05 2:07:48

In October. So seventy-five here shortly. Yeah, I mean, we've we've put out so much, and and it's just like hobby and and playing fun, but I think we'll have to restructure all of our stuff monetarily and with copyrights and things because I have bands that are like signed on big labels that are like, as long as you ain't getting no money, I'm like, dude, I don't know when that's gonna happen. But it it's coming close. And thank you guys so much for supporting us. Check us out on all the socials and all the things, right? Lindsay.

SPEAKER_00 2:08:25

So really quick, uh, so our main website is drinkabout something. We are drinkaboutsomething pod at gmail.com and on uh fucking TikTok.

SPEAKER_07 2:08:39

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 2:08:39

Drinkabout something underscore, no, drinkabout something pod underscore Lindsay, where we do lives once a week.

SPEAKER_06 2:08:45

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 2:08:46

YouTube, we are Gen Z.

SPEAKER_05 2:08:48

Just type in J-E-N-D-S-E-Y, and you will find us and you can come party with us. Yes.

SPEAKER_00 2:08:55

We really appreciate your rates and reviews and comments because that helps us get into the algorithm. Help this be our job, and we can give you more content.

SPEAKER_07 2:09:05

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 2:09:05

We got cases and bands saved for years in advance.

SPEAKER_05 2:09:10

We do, and we're gonna be going into season three in October, but we got a ways to go, and we got so many bands to share, and we got so many stories to share. Lindsay, you have fucked me again, and I just wanted you to say your famous words. No, you know what? I want Alex to say it. We love you so much, and we want you to say the famous words, Alex.

SPEAKER_03 2:09:31

Alright, here we go.

SPEAKER_05 2:09:33

Bye!

SPEAKER_03 2:09:34

Yes!